Ohio Residency

[GaryAnnable]

Can anyone offer any critique on the use of Cincinnati, OH (pre-retirement/workcamping FMCA Member) for use as a domicile? It seems to be a logical choice, with our current FMCA "PMB", however, I have yet to find any discussion, pro or con, on the topic.

Our primary concerns are:

#1) Health Insurance cost,

#2) License & Vehicle registration & renewal requirements,

#3) Taxes (incl: income, sales, vehicle excise/personal property).

We are currently struggling with our choice of domicile. Having left Western New York 4 years ago, and full timing since December 2009, we need to choose a new domicile, as our health insurance (NY) is skyrocketing. Ohio seems to be a viable option, with Ohio rates (ehealthinsurance.com) being more affordable?

However, as I mentioned, I have not come across any discussion of Ohio as a domicile, and am therefore wondering about the pitfalls ...

Any comments on Ohio vs Texas, would also be helpful.

[wolfe10]

To make a wise decision (and it sounds like you are looking at many of the important variables) you need to look at the NET cost of each choice. And it will be different depending on your particular situation (income, value of RV, etc).

Example: Texas does not have income tax. Texas RV registration is fairly low. Texas has no personal properly tax on RVs. Some of the reasons Texas is popular as an address for full timers. I am not familiar with Ohio.

Brett

[ClayL]

I suspect the reason you don't see any discussions about OH as a full timing choice is that it is seldom a choice - most likely because of some of the items you mentioned.

The three top runners are SD TX and FL. Many (maybe most?) full timers pick one of those three.

There may be some differences in health insurance cost in various states but I would be very surprised if there is a large difference. For a difference to exist I would think two factors would come into play.

1)The claims in the state would have to be much lower than other states and I don't see that happening in OH.

2) State regulation would have to force pricing down - I haven't heard of that in OH.

It will be interesting to see what other folks say about OH.

[tbutler]

When we went full time almost 10 years ago there was a booklet which we purchased that dealt with full timing decision on state of residency. Choosing Your RV Home Base does an analysis of all states and compares not only licensing and taxes but also covers other factors, how to establish residency, laws related to inheritance taxes, etc. I highly recommend this booklet. We considered a number of states, some were eliminated because of the distance from where we would normally be traveling (mail delivery delays). Alaska would be fine but who wants their mail to go to Alaska and then have it forwarded to Florida? Vermont looked good but they require six months in residence to qualify as a resident. You get the idea. There are many things to consider. We came to the conclusion above, Florida, Texas or South Dakota. We were residents of South Dakota for 9 1/2 years before actually moving to a house in Texas this last summer. Ohio was never on our radar.

Besides the book above, there are numerous discussions on the Web. Simply do a search for RV state of residency and you can get hundreds of opinions.

[pweaver123@gmail.com]

We left Ohio last October and established residence in Texas. No incomes taxes, WARM, jobs, WARM, growing, WARM,

[tbutler]

Don't let warm keep you from considering South Dakota. They recently upped their residency requirements. I think you have to show a receipt for one night in an RV park or hotel to establish residency now! It's plenty warm there in the summer! In 91/2 years in South Dakota, we were never there in the winter... duh!

[Guest BillAdams]

Don't let anyone tell you that your State of residency does not effect your health insurance premiums. While we are FL residents, we had used a Branson, MO mailing address and this is what our health insurance folks used as our premium basis (we had no idea). We contacted them and let them know that our new "mailing address" would be Livingston, TX and we got a health insurance bill that was more than double our previous bill. It was explained to us that our move from MO to TX forced this increase. Have you ever tried to explain your full-time life style to a Corporation? We never could, be we did finally convince them that we were actually FL residents and they only raised our premiums 25%! Nice!

If your health insurance premiums are an important factor, be sure to contact your insurance company before you make a decision to see how such a move would effect your premiums.

[hermanmullins]

We left Ohio last October and established residence in Texas. No incomes taxes, WARM, jobs, WARM, growing, WARM,

So Paul, do you like our warm weather? Compared to Ohio it isn't too cold . However it is 35 degrees here in the DFW area. But I will take that anyday over white outs and snow on the ground for several months.

So WELCOME to TEXAS and warm weather.

Oh yea, Merry Christmas.

[pweaver123@gmail.com]

Yeah Herman/Bobbie....love Texas warm weather. It's much warmer in the RGV than in Dallaas area. It surprised me how much the weather differed between Dallas and Houston (we have a daughter in area of each).

Stay warm

Paul

[GaryAnnable]

We left Ohio last October and established residence in Texas. No incomes taxes, WARM, jobs, WARM, growing, WARM,

Warm isn't really a factor for us, as we will not necessarily spend any time in our "domicile" state anyway. Warm, or more accurately not frigid is an issue, if we are required to visit that state at an inopportune time, however. We are currently in the RGV, so for ease of establishing, Texas would be at the top of the list. Conversely, Ohio has been our mailing address for over a year now and health insurance premiums are lower there.

The question is what is required to establish (and maintain) residency in OH and what are the pitfalls? We will not work in Ohio, so income taxes should not be an issue. Is there a personal property taxon motorhomes? Are automobile: insurance and registration rates competitive? Is it safe to assume that your Ohio retirement income is taxed and is therefore your primary reason for changing to Texas?

Thanks for you thoughts.

Gary Annable

Kenwood RV Park

LaFeria, TX

[Guest Wayne77590]

Gary,

It is not just the income taxes on what you make working, as all of your income can be taxable. So any retirement income could be taxable. It is state by state and it is something that one needs to check out before making a decision.

Brett pointed out some good reasons to choose Texas. And, if you are 60% handicapped or more, your RV registrations will cost you $8.00. A lot of "aging" rv'ers have migrated into that category for one reason or another.

Happy hunting.

[chucknewman]

Gary,

Several years before we retired we purchased the book Tom Butler recommended. It is full of timely and concise information to make a wise choice of home base selection. Also their was a great treatise on the web at the time. I can't find the link now. And as mentioned, their are several forums on line that you can get more info regarding the Domicile issue. Unfortunately, most states have different Domicile requirements so you need to research and read for yourself the current requirements for the State you are interested in. Many can be found on line.

From the standpoint of taxation, vehicle insurance rates, vehicle registration fees, vehicle sales tax rate, no vehicle safety or smog inspections; as a combination, you won't find a cheaper state than South Dakota. And as fulltime RV'ers Domiciled in Minnehaha County, we are exempt from jury duty requirements. Not the case for most other SD counties. That said, you need to query your health insurance company about insurance costs there. As Bill Adams noted, location does make a difference -- depending on the carrier.

The Homeland Security Act of 2005 has mandated that all states implement new residency and security issues. SD is no different, but I can say it still is one of the easiest to become a Domiciled resident, and still be a fulltime RV'er. We recently got our new "Federally compliant" South Dakota drivers licenses. Totally different from the original versions. And it only took one form with two simple questions.

If you're adamant about Ohio for some reason, I can say it won't be the least costly home base.

Most of the folks I know with Domicile problems have a drivers license in one state, vehicle registration in another state, and work or live in yet another state. I realize you are not looking at this scenario, but I present it for general information.

[tmatlock]

I live in Ohio at this time because of my children and grandchildren but if I had a totally free choice it would be one of the last places I would live primarily due to the totality of taxes you pay here. Texas was a good place to live and I probably would chose that state if it were not for my family.

[pdhardin@gmail.com]

One thing to consider is your drivers license. Ohio will not allow you to use Round Bottom Road as your address for your drivers license since it is a business and not a residence. I think all the states are stricter on this since 9/11. We were refused renewal of our Ohio drivers licenses because we wanted to use the FMCA mailing address as our new address. We have since become Florida residents.

[drwyatt]

It seems that a number of places to consider a Domicile are tagged by the Postal Service and other government agencies as a mail forward location and not really a residence. Also an item that a lot of people don't consider is the driver license requirement for driving a RV or Truck pulling a trailer. Texas for example requires you to actually drive your RV or Truck and trailer to get a class B license if the total weight of the vehicle or combo weight is over 21,000 lb GVRW. This means that most all medium or larger RV's and truck trailers combinations will require a class 'B' licensed driver whether in Texas or any other state. There are several other states that have this license requirement. South Dakota, Arizona and a few others do not. In my case I would have to take my 45 ft motorhome to Texas and actually drive it in a test to claim Texas as a domicile and get a legal drivers license. Things like this makes a domocile decision more complicated. New Homeland Security rulings will future complicate things for full time RVing.

[Adogman60]

Health care costs at present are not a problem as I am retired military and over 65. I am medicare and tricare. I do not pay any premiums and have received few billings from any doctors and none from any hopitals. It wouldnt make any difference as to shere I lived. Prescriptions are mail order at a minimum cost.

Personal Property taxes in Ohio do not apply to RV's

Vehicle Insurance. - The last article I saw on it this past summer listed Ohio as having one of the lowest five insurance rates.

State Income Taxes. - I have 2 retirements. Federal civil Service and Military. The state of Ohio no longer taxes the Military retirements and the formula by which they calculate the nontaxability also has spilled over in reducing the taxable pension. The only state tax that affects me is a local school tax which is .75% which not, to me, an opressive amount. Relocating to a state with no income tax would save me a little state taxes but not enough to force relocation

The negative is the cold winters..

I really dont see any reason to change to immediately change my residency although weather may play a larger part.

[janandkathy]

Six years ago we moved to East Tennessee from VA. There are alot of people from Ohio who have moved here also. No income tax, no personal property tax, low registration fees for RVs (Coaches- $24/yr, trailers-$50 for a permanent plate), and the cost of living is reasonable. not sure on the differences on health insurance.

[jdthud]

I have been continuously RVing since 1975. I am now full time. I have searched for answers to many questions. Times have changed and the answers have changed. Talk to the people in the campground you stay in. Also go on the web. Suggest talking to Americas -Mail.com in SD. There are several others in SD. They are my mail forwarding and residency info headquarters for very good info as the owner is a fulltimer.

JDTHUD

[tbutler]

It seems that a number of places to consider a Domicile are tagged by the Postal Service and other government agencies as a mail forward location and not really a residence. Also an item that a lot of people don't consider is the driver license requirement for driving a RV or Truck pulling a trailer. Texas for example requires you to actually drive your RV or Truck and trailer to get a class B license if the total weight of the vehicle or combo weight is over 21,000 lb GVRW. This means that most all medium or larger RV's and truck trailers combinations will require a class 'B' licensed driver whether in Texas or any other state. There are several other states that have this license requirement. South Dakota, Arizona and a few others do not. In my case I would have to take my 45 ft motorhome to Texas and actually drive it in a test to claim Texas as a domicile and get a legal drivers license. Things like this makes a domocile decision more complicated. New Homeland Security rullings will future complicate things for full time RVing.

I've encountered the USPS and Government identification of our address in South Dakota as a business address instead of a residential address. The FAA balked at changing my address for my pilot's license to that location. I sent them a letter explaining that we lived full time in a motor home and had no other address than our legal address at the PMB in South Dakota. I also pointed out to them the utter nonsense of the most mobile of all transportation refusing to accept a motor home as a legal residence. This resulted in their accepting the address, no further problems. It did take a little more communication to clear this up but it was done even with a federal agency like the FAA. In recent times I've seen less of this problem to the point that I can't even think of a recent event where this has cropped up.

Regarding the Texas license requirements, I have just received my Texas drivers license (Class "B") which entitles me to drive a vehicle of greater than 26,000 pounds towing a trailer with a weight less than 10,000 pounds. This license was obtained without taking a test (written or driving) because the license I held from South Dakota entitled me to drive the motor home and Texas granted the license on that basis. Louise and I simply turned in our South Dakota licenses and received the Texas license. Now, if you are a Texas resident and purchase a motor home with a weight greater than 26,000 pounds you will have to take a written and driving test to get your class B license - go figure!

The Department of Homeland Security is making everything more difficult for those of us who live below the radar! We will have continuing challenges in the future but organizations like FMCA and others will be working to explain our existence and purpose to those who restrict our activities. We are the envy of many but few really understand us!

[chucknewman]

"...the license I held from South Dakota entitled me to drive the motor home and Texas granted the license on that basis.

Tom,

I presume you had either a SD class1 or class2 license? I think you got lucky, or Texas has recently changed their codes regarding heavy RV's. I've read many posts on various boards over time that people who transfer their license from a state that allows driving a motorhome of any weight with air brakes (like a class "C" license in California) to Texas (and some other states), still had to test for the Texas non-commercial class B. In fact as I recall, when we were considering Texas as a domicile, that state's DL requirements for RV's over certain weights was one (of many) reasons we chose South Dakota.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with Texas' requirements. Certainly I've seen many quirks, particularly when we lived in California. I'm just curious what is now required in Texas.

It sounds like you have changed domicile to Texas. Can you share your thoughts on that?

Thanks,

Chuck

[tbutler]

Chuck,

Regarding the license, both Louise and I were given a Texas Class B license without any test other than vision which is required at any renewal anyway. Our South Dakota license was a standard drivers license, not a class 1 or 2 or CDL. The license clearly stated car and light truck. However as you know, that license is all that is needed in South Dakota to drive a motor home of any size as long as it is privately (not commercially) owned. We were surprised. We were prepared to take the written and driving test for a Class B license. I don't know what the clerk at the license office was looking up on her computer but suspect that it listed licenses with equivalent driving privileges in other states. For those familiar with South Dakota licensing procedures, the Texas process is completely primitive. We stand in line for an hour and a half to get to one of two or three clerks working. After submitting all our documents, getting photographed and taking eye tests, etc. we are given a paper license which is good for 60 days during which time we should get the actual license in the mail. Mine had a misspelling on it so I had to wait in line again and get another paper license until the corrected real license arrives in February (I hope). We have a friend who has been brought to tears by repeated attempts to deal with this system.

Regarding changing our domicile, we have indeed done that. We have a permanent address here and are still learning about how that will affect us. The licensing of vehicles was fairly simple but the expense was about 20% greater than South Dakota with the car being the biggest increase. There was an initial tax on both vehicles which accounts for part of this. That tax ($60.00) was the same for both the car and motor home so I would guess it is essentially a processing fee. As the year goes on, we'll see how the other expenses shake out. We should be getting our assessments for property in the near future and that will be an expense we didn't have before. The bad news is that Texas is pretty much in the same financial situation as the state of California. I'm bracing for a series of tax increases or serious curtailing of services.

As this process goes on, I'll keep everyone here on the forum posted. You might also check my BLOG here at FMCA for some of my reflections on changing states and changing from living full time in the motor home to living in a sticks and bricks home again.

[chucknewman]

Now I understand, Tom. We do what we have to do as we move forward.

We've been in Falfurrias since November and will be here until the end of February. I'll try to contact you the next time we plan a trip down your way.

Good luck to you on your new venture.

Chuck

[GaryAnnable]

Thanks to everyone for your input. It appears as though there is a consensus that there is no singular BEST answer. I will continue to research, but will not likley pursue Ohio residency ...

[GaryAnnable]

We have since changed our "domicile" to South Dakota, only to find out, after the fact, that "Wellmark" (Blue Cross/Blue Shield) DOES NOT write health insurance for full time RVers! While I did research pricing, I did not ask this specific question. This was/is our primary concern, at this stage in our lives, with both my wife and myself being under 60 years of age.

Are there any other "youngsters" out there who have health insurance outside of their "domiciled" state? We still use FMCA mail forwarding, if we can use this to obtain Health Insurance in Ohio, it would save us approximately $250.00 / mo.