Full-timing: The Breakaway!

[tbutler]

Let's start a discussion of various aspects of full-timing. Those of us who have already made the break can discuss how we came to the decision to sell the bricks and sticks house and move into a very small but mobile space. It is important to remember that there are no absolutes in this discussion. Each of us arrived at this decision via our own personal route for our own personal reasons.

We'll leave it to others (perhaps those who hope to join us) to challenge and question us about our decisions.

I'll kick things off with a few thoughts of my own. Please add your own experiences.

In 1998 Louise retired from public education. I followed in 1999. For two years after this we worked for a company in Chicago, making trips back and forth regularly. We also did some traveling, going to Paris in the summer of 1999 and to Africa in the spring of 2001. Meanwhile we had traveled to meetings in several locations in the US flying commercial for some and flying in single engine airplanes when possible.

On one such trip we drove from Phoenix to Lake Havasu City to visit Louise's mother. Being February we passed through Quartzite and saw the assemblage of RV's. Our discussion began. In Lake Havasu City we saw an RV dealer lot and the discussion continued. Before we left Lake Havasu City, we stopped in to check out the RV's. A very nice and patient salesman spent several hours showing us everything from the Prevost once owned by a NASCAR driver who lost his sponsor to toy haulers.

We asked the salesman about information on RV'ing and he referred us to a book titled: Movin' On by Ron and Barb Hofmeister. Written in 1999, this book contains information that is now somewhat dated but describes the experiences of a couple who started in a Class C motor home and went full time. For those considering starting in a Class C, I would recommend this book. The cell/computer information is way out of date but the considerations of packing for a small vehicle are still good. The book had excellent descriptions of what it was like to travel full time, the advantages and disadvantages. I would still recommend it for that content alone.

We read the book from end to end and discussed it over and over. We convinced ourselves that we could do it, make the break from our fixed home to a mobile life. We began looking at RV's everything from 5th wheels to motor homes. By March of 2001 we had settled on a motor home and found one to purchase, a used 1994 Monaco Dynasty. We parked it in storage. After we returned from Africa, we decided to quit our jobs and live on our retirement income. The dye was cast, we began the process of getting ready for the road.

[ClayL]

We are sort of “accidental†full timers.

We didn't intend to full time, just wanted to take a three to six month trip around the country visiting friends and family and then find some warmer, cheaper place to buy or build a house.

We threw away stuff, gave stuff to places that could make use of it and distributed as much as possible to our kids.

We put all of the rest of our stuff in storage so we wouldn't have to go back to NH if the house sold quickly and it was still cold and yucky there.

The house did sell quickly (in a month) and we found after about a year that we were having so much fun traveling and having no ties to a stick house that we decided to keep on full timing. We traded the 96 motor home in on a new 2004 with a lot more CCC, storage space and two slides.

That was 6 years ago and so far we both love the life style. We intend to continue full timing until we get too old or too sick or too bored to do it any longer.

[tbutler]

Thanks Clay and Lee,

It's an interesting way to get to full timing! Louise and I are in the same place, this won't end until something drives us from it. For now we are happy travelers! Had a good laugh at the name of your cat. I knew a man once who had a dog named Dammit. I think it may have had a first name also but I won't mention that.

[ClayL]

Thanks Clay and Lee,

Had a good laugh at the name of your cat. I knew a man once who had a dog named Dammit. I think it may have had a first name also but I won't mention that.

Her name suits her quite well. She actually has a first name also - Nicki - but she answers to both.

[tbutler]

Her name suits her quite well. She actually has a first name also - Nicki - but she answers to both.

A cat that answers to one name is amazing. A cat that answers to two names is... well, is there a cat MENSA?

[ClayL]

A cat that answers to one name is amazing. A cat that answers to two names is... well, is there a cat MENSA?

I guess I should qualify that and add - as much as a cat answers to a name - which is only when it suits her.

She knows both names refer to her but she doesn't feel that it's necessary to acknowledge it with anything other than an ear twitch unless we are telling her about something that is interesting to her.

This is the first cat we have had (she believes she has us though) and all I can say is cats are weird.

[ITResC@gmx.com]

I find this topic very interesting. Anyway I read Tom's story with interest, because I am on the cusp of departing as a full timer. Actually I guess I can't call myself a full timer, because I will still have a fixed bricks and morter home for a while.

The economic situation has changed some plans, because the anticipated sale of the house is now not as reasonable as it once was. So the concept now is to be an extended traveler until the market improves. It adds a financial burden that will make the early part of the travel a little different then I had hoped. The mortgage is paid off, but shutting down a house still requires some cash input to city, county and state. And to all of you who ask "Why doesn't she rent it"? the answer is because I have rented homes before and the disaster I came back to was not worth the rent I accumulated. I was military for 28 years and had change of station orders that caused me to rent my home several times. Even with property management, renters do not care for a house the way an owner does. There are also significant tax differences between a rental and owner occupied house.

I read with interest Tom Butler's desciption of residency and although it was my first plan to switch to either South Dakota or Texas, your comments about making a complete change now seems slightly more difficult. May have to live with my present state of residence for a while, since I can not make the complete change as he suggests.

I am still interested in hearing about those of you who have transferred residency from one state to another. I have read all the books about what each state offers, but I would like to hear real world experiences about changing drivers licenses and registration for motorhome and toad, tax impact of pension income, cost of living and any tales where you thought it was a good or bad idea?

Cathe

2005 Alfa See Ya Gold

2004 Acura MDX

Soon to be full timer August 2009.

[tbutler]

Cathe,

Thanks for your story. We'll be looking forward to seeing you on the road!

I'll give you some details of our move. After doing the book study and deciding on South Dakota, we corresponded with Ron Triebwasser at My Home Address. He recommended an attorney who handled a number of his clients so we made an appointment with her. We signed up with Ron and he gave us our new address. We flew to Sioux Falls one weekend, rented a car. Our first stop the next morning was at the drivers license bureau. We turned in our Missouri drivers licenses and got new South Dakota licenses with our new address on the spot. Our SD drivers licenses expire every 5 years. Our motor home was purchased from individuals so we didn't have license plates on it yet. We went to Ron and accompanied him to the the county court house and registered the motor home and got our license plate for it (that is the short version, it took a little more than that because of special circumstances). After the meeting with our attorney, our wills and estate were modified for South Dakota laws. That concluded our visit to South Dakota.

We returned home, put the new plates on our motor home, moved it out of storage and began moving into it. Our house wasn't sold, it wasn't even cleaned out yet. We found a park near our home and commuted to the house every day, going about the process of cleaning it out and fixing it up. We took trips on weekends to get familiar with our new home. I had a workshop to attend in Florida so we spent a week and half on that trip. When we returned we moved into another park with better facilities. We got the car licensed about a month after the motor home. It was all done by mail.

We finished moving out of the house and now moved to another RV park closer to our children. We stayed there until late in November. Just before we left we finally sold my pickup truck. We were now down to the motor home, our car and a tow dolly. We headed south to New Orleans and spent a long Thanksgiving weekend enjoying the southern breezes. Louise cooked Thanksgiving dinner in the RV! From there we went to Houston where I had flight training scheduled with the Texas Air Aces. I would learn to fly and recover from unusual attitudes in small airplanes. We spent a week there, enjoyed Tomball and Spring. We left Houston in a heavy downpour headed for San Antonio. Friends from our pilot's group in Missouri met us in San Antonio and showed us around the area. We entertained in our motor home for the first time. We stayed in Boerne just north of San Antonio the month of December. We returned to Missouri at Christmas and were able to sign the papers for the sale of our home while there.

When we returned to Boerne, the weather was colder than we had hoped for so we took the advice of the campground owner in Tomball who suggested we might enjoy "the valley," the Rio Grande Valley of extreme south Texas. On January 1 we left Boerne and didn't stop until we got to Edinburg, Texas. On the way south, Louise had found us an RV park. We pulled in and said we would stay for three days. Shortly after arriving we went back to the office and extended our stay to a week. Before the week was up, we extended to a month and then two months. We left at the end of February for other commitments. We have been back to that park every winter since.

Now I go through all this to show that the break with the old home state can be a gradual one. How fast you are able to make that transition may depend on a lot of things but the important thing is that you continue to make progress to get it all together in your new state.

As soon as we had our address and our drivers licenses, we contacted our retirement system and had our address changed. This immediately stopped the state withholding on our paychecks. That was about a $1000 a month pay raise. Various pension systems have their own rules about residency and how it affects taxes on pensions. I believe that California pensioners have to pay California taxes on their pension no matter where they live.

In 2002 I filed my last Missouri state income tax for the part of the year 2001 we lived in Missouri. There is no income tax in South Dakota and we don't have to file a form. I hadn't thought about that in a while, I remember being so happy, just filing that Missouri form was such a pain, not talking about the money, talking about all the quirky rules! Now it is just a distant memory.

As to cost of living, I'll refer you to a post I made about 2 weeks ago on under the heading: Buying a Motorhome:Cost of Motorhome Ownership. In that post I put our budget for major items in actual dollar terms. Our lifestyle and motor home affect those numbers, I know there are people who spend less, likely lots less, and there are those who spend much more.

Hope some of this helps. Keep asking questions...

[DougC]

Hi Tom,

An interesting subject and timely for us...

You may know from our blog that Trudy and I are leaving in the morning for a 4-5 week trip in our 2003 Newmar KS. This will be the first time Trudy has used an RV at all.

We are both in our mid-late 60's and have been pondering the meaning of life, our kids are grown and on their own. We met on a blind date in December of 2007 and have been together since. We are both in reasonable good health, considering our ages. I still work in a school district but will retire in July. Trudy retired from casinos a few years ago and works part time now.

I had the RV and now we are going to use it.... we've had limited talks about where to live, how to live, what to do with the RV. Do we become full-timers? Is sounds appealing.... this month long trip will help provide an answer to that question.

The full-timer forum discussion is interesting... we'll follow the forum discussion and offer our experience and thoughts.

Doug

[ClayL]

SNIP

I am still interested in hearing about those of you who have transferred residency from one state to another. I have read all the books about what each state offers, but I would like to hear real world experiences about changing drivers licenses and registration for motor home and toad, tax impact of pension income, cost of living and any tales where you thought it was a good or bad idea?

Cathe

2005 Alfa See Ya Gold

2004 Acura MDX

Soon to be full timer August 2009.

Four years ago when we moved from NH to SD, we stopped at an RV park in Sioux Falls that was recommended by Alternative Resources (the mail forwarding service we chose). Any of our mail that goes to them (such as state voting info) they send over to Alternative Resources. The address of the RV park is the address we used to register to vote.

A drivers license sub-unit is about 50 yards from the Alternative Resources office and an insurance broker is next door. We handled everything in a few hours one morning and were SD residents that afternoon.

For a fee Alternative Resources took care of our vehicle and motor home title work, registration and tax. We had not paid a sales tax in NH, so we paid a 1.8% one time tax on the present value of the motor home and car. I don't know where the 1.8% figure came from because the SD web site says it is 3% (unless you paid that much or more in another state).

We handle the plate renewals ourselves on-line. Our car and motor home plates this year cost a total of $186.

We still have our bank account in NH and our stuff stored there. Both of those things will change in the near future.

For some info on setting up a domicile you might want to take a look HERE.

The move to SD was a real winner for us. In NH the motor home plates cost us $1400 the year we moved. It would have gone down a little each year but not all that much. Our vehicle insurance also went down quite a bit.

There are no vehicle inspection stickers required in SD and that's a plus.

I got a jury summons and called the court clerk. She said to write "I am a full time RVer" on the summons and return it and she would take me and my wife off the list. We do have to go back every five years to renew or drivers licenses ($8 as I recall).

The Alternative Resources web site HERE has some good info on taxes and other advantages of being a SD resident.

[jim@collardscorner.com]

Great Topic! Thought I would share some of our experiences and thoughts to the discussion.

Dorthey and I are from Juneau, Alaska (although we have lived in a number of Alaska locations), and began researching used motorhomes in 2002 as we anticipated retiring in 2003. Our goal was to avoid winters in Alaska and spend summers RVing. Our research was exclusively via the Internet as it is not possible to go out and "kick tires" on RVs in Juneau. We had owned a Monaco Class C used mostly for fishing trips in Alaska with our kids but were sure we wanted a Class A for the extra room and amenities.

We had never heard of full-time RVing, but during Google searches I happened on to several websites put up by full-timers who described the life style and their experiences in sometimes significant detail. This revelation planted the seed and by the fall of 2002 we had decided to buy a new Class A, sell our home, and become full-time RVers. We said we would give it 3-5 years and go back to sticks and bricks if the lifestyle wasn't for us. We decided on the Alfa SeeYa Class A and requested on-line quotes from outside dealers. "Outside" is how Alaskans refer the lower forty eight states--if it isn't inside Alaska, then it is outside.

Selling the house in early 2003 was straight forward, but deciding what to keep and what to sell, and what we would store versus what would be needed in the motorhome was a bit of a chore. Finally, we agreed to go through the house together, room by room, touching each and every object in it and making a decision...sell, give to kids, keep, keep for now and decide later. This process took some days but went a long way to preserving our marriage since all decisions were joint ones. Of course I was given the opportunity to go through the garage alone as Dorthey was in her sewing/crafts room. However, each of us was also tasked with identifying the space required for the things we wanted to bring aboard the SeeYa we had ordered from a Mesa, Arizona, dealer.

We both retired May 30, 2003--Dorthey from the Alaska State Department of Labor and I from the telephone company. We had sold our home a couple months before and were living in a furnished rental condo by that time. The motorhome stuff was stacked in boxes in one bedroom. The first of June we flew to Phoenix and took possession of our 2003 40' Alfa SeeYa. We drove the coach back as far as Seattle, flew to Juneau, loaded a Uhaul trailer with our stuff, put it and the car on the ferry, and headed for Washington.

Our first outing was attending Life On Wheels in Moscow, Idaho. We counted that experience as one of the most beneficial things we did in starting out as full-timing chichakos (Alaskan for tenderfeet). Anyone not sure about entering the RV life either full-time or part time should attend Life On Wheels in my humble opinion.

Our state of domicile remains Alaska. It is, in fact, a good state for full-timers as there is no state income tax, no state sales tax, and to personal property taxes, or vehicle taxes. Our two year license renewal for the motorhome is $120, as it was when the Alfa was new. This was not a hard decision for us as Alaska is home (Dorthey was born and raised there).

We've been on the road since retirement and haven't looked back. We traded the 2003 Alfa for a 2007 Alfa a year before Alfa went out of business and though we were sorry to see them go, we still love our Alfa. One thing that we have discovered to be true of ourselves that may or may not be true for other full-timers has to do with how long one stays in one place. We have meandered about with short stays along the way, we have stayed for a week, or a month here or there, even 3 months and 5 months on a couple occasions. For us, it seems, the longer we stay in one place the smaller the motorhome gets. Others like spending the winter in one place and enjoying the ambiance of friends and activities that snowbird RV resorts are known for. We like those things, too, and have made an incredibly large number of new friends in the RV world, some who are full-time and others who snowbird to the same place each winter. We just spend a few weeks with them and enjoy the benefits of resort living, then move on to our next adventure.

I could go on and on but will call an end here.

Best wishes to all,

Jim Collard

2007 Alfa SoooLong

Alfa Owners Club, Roadrunners Chapter

FMCA F329701

[2bcsnowbirds]

My husband and I live in British Columbia, Canada and so a lot of the tax implications etc don't apply to us. However, the discussion on being a full timer is dear to our hearts. My husband currently works 3 days per week but plans to retire next June.....we bought a 2003 40ft motorhome last fall in preparation for this event.

We spent Jan & Feb in Arizona this past winter and loved it. We will spend our summers mostly in Canada as there is lots we want to see from BC to New Foundland.....but our winters will be spent in the southern USA. We met some wonderful people this past winter and can't wait to see our new friends again. Everywhere we went, all the American people we came in contact with were so helpful and friendly. Rvers in general are friendly...it seems you automaticlly have one thing is common with them all...your rv and the experiences you can share. We sold our house 2 years ago and downsized into a condo so living with less stuff is partly completed. We will keep some of the furniture because we have been advised by our full timing friends that if our health goes....it might be nice to have a park model somewhere as a home base and because we do need an address to tie us to Canada when we cross the border.And we need to return here to file income tax each April.

Spending 2 months in the RV showed us how comfortable we will be and what a relaxing lifestyle it is. We love meeting new people and found staying about 2 weeks in one place was enough to give us the bug to move again. Maybe that will change after we have travelled a few years. Our kids and grandkids think it's great as long as we keep in touch. With email, webcams and facebook we can let them see what we are doing. We met one couple who sold their house and worked 3 more years while living in their 5th wheel so they could top up their saving for their retirement. They were very comfortable and planned to continue full timing after retirement.

[ITResC@gmx.com]

I really appreciate the perspectives that each of you brings to the topic. Jim Collard.. I plan on joining Roadrunners when I get out there. Have friends/neighbors and my first mentors George and Robin who will be wagonmasters for the Roadrunner Quartzsite rally this coming January. My first extended trip is a caravan to the Western National Parks followed by a trip to Texas to explore the gulf coast. Taking some time to enjoy extended travel and wait for the economy to come back to it's senses.

Jim Collard I agree wholehearted with that recommendation to attend the Life on Wheels. I took my ALFA Gold from northern California to Idaho for the 2007 session right after I bought it. I am like you, I think it was the greatest experience of my young career with an RV. Being new to the RV and all that is requried to understand it, the Life on Wheels started my quest for more information. Unfortunately with the death last year of the founder and champion of the program Gaylord Maxwell Life on Wheels ceased to exist. It is a great loss to all RVers.

I recommend the RV Driving School for anyone with a copilot who is hesitant to get behind the wheel, or even the experienced pilots could learn a bit as well in the eight hour course.

So my question to those of you who have changed domicile, I gather there has been no downside to the process, or regrets since you did it? Anyone else out there have Texas as a new domicile? What is your experince with switching residence to Texas?

Cathe

2005 ALFA See Ya Gold

2004 Acura MDX toad

To be a fulltimer August 2009

[ITResC@gmx.com]

Tom Butler, just a point of clarification: California lost a court case a number of years ago and is not allowed to with hold state income taxes on pension income, if you are a resident of another state. They have a terrible problem with managing their budget thus my interest in leaving it behind in the rear view mirror.

I was expecially interested in your comments about getting personal legal documents within the legal parameters of your new state of domicile. I hadn't thought about that, so it is something I am going to add to my checklist.

Cathe

2005 ALFA See Ya Gold

2004 Acura MDX toad

To be a fulltimer August 2009

[tbutler]

Cathie,

Thanks for the latest news on California. My information was indeed several years old. Good to know that people really can escape from California!

As to the legal documents, the last thing most of us want is to leave a muddled mess for the courts to decide for our heirs. The more air-tight your will and/or trust can be, the easier for those who will inherit from you. This is also the reasoning behind making your residence choice as solid as possible. Eliminate as much doubt as possible.

[ITResC@gmx.com]

Just had an interesting thought... for the 2bcsnowbirds... I have met a few Canadians in and around Yuma and Lake Havasu last year when I spent a few weeks. Lovely people and interesting. Canada has some beautiful places to explore. Do you have any knowledge of Americans traveling the reverse direction to establish domicile in Canada? Americans go to Mexico to live, so why not Canada. What do you think an American would find if they did take that step?

[tbutler]

Cathe,

This is a long delay in getting a response but here is what I know. We have a niece that works in Canada. She moved there from the US about 20 years ago. She owns a home in Calgary. She is quite happy there and has no plans for returning. She was married to a Canadian briefly and has dual citizenship. I don't know about her health coverage but since she has lived there full time for 20 years, I would guess she has the Canadian national health plan.

A second example is a couple we know, the woman is from the US and a Canadian man who are married and have a home in BC north of Vancouver. That also is a long term change and they both seem to be doing fine with it. They have started traveling south for the winters so each is in a foreign country for about 1/2 the year. Again I don't know about the health issue, somebody from Canada might have an answer about how that works. The health issue of course wouldn't apply for someone who is just spending summers in Canada. For those from the US you would likely either have to return to the US for major health care or use an emergency room kind of treatment for a minor issue. The next time we see them we'll ask them some questions about how well this works. If I get an answer soon, I'll post it here.

A third example, another couple we know, not married, man from the US, woman from Canada. They spend their summers in Canada just across the border from Champlain, NY and their winters in south Texas. They live in an apartment in Canada so don't own any property. He gets his medical care in the US and she gets her care when needed in Canada other than minor treatment in Texas.

We winter with enough Canadians that I should be able to get some better answers in a few days once we are back in Texas. Louise and I have spent large parts of four summers traveling in Canada and always find it to be very interesting. We have always periodically returned to the US just to get back to our familiar phone and internet connections and pick up mail and purchase fuel at more reasonable US prices. If we were to stay in one spot for a long time, we could make arrangements for internet, phone and mail services but being on the move, it doesn't pay to do so. We keep in touch with family with WiFi connections when we can find them, reserving the cell phone for emergency contacts.

[migrantdawgs]

I see that this is an 'older posted' forum but still a lively topic for those of us new to the FMCA - so I'm gonna jump in here. We've been full-timers for a year now, and are a little unusual in that we are not retired.

I own a consulting business in the health field and do a lot of travel. The last year before fulltiming, I was only home one solid month out of the entire year! All the travel was taking it's toll on me - the hotels, the restaurants, and not having my dogs with me for extended periods. It was my dream that 'when I'm older' I'd move into a RV full time...but I thought that was years away.

Then last June, I went to bed frazzled over travel and woke up the next morning with a clear plan: move into an RV. I knew NOTHING about RV's, had never even been in one - but the RV passion was somehow ignited and my husband decided it was dangerous to ignore it. I went and bought a book on RV's and full-timing ('for dummies'), all the RV related magazines I could find, and pulled up all the internet sites I could find. I researched the **** out of every topic. We decided on a Class A because we knew we'd want some room (still glad we did that...) and started shopping.

We got took a bit by the dealer when we bought a used Holiday Rambler Endeavor - there are things I would do different in that transaction - but by July 4 of 2010 we drove away in our new home. The first year we've learned a LOT of lessons that no one can really help you with. A lot of what we learned had to do with working together as a team on the road so that all went smoothly. We watched couples 'have at it' over backing in a rig, and so we figured out how to do our hand signals...things like that. We figured out how to save money - and we're still learning the ins and outs of maintenance. Little things - like buying an air compressor - saves so much stress looking for a gas station that will fit our 40' class A w/ toad to air up tires...

We work on the road - so we limit our travels to areas where we know we can get internet (we also have a Verizon air card, but it's not good 'everywhere' - ) and cell service. We love waking up in new scenery, finding new Farmer's Market's for fresh local foods, new hikes and bike rides, and our dogs are much better behaved now that we are with them consistently for training. We see more of the grandchildren.

After a year of fulltiming, I can't imagine why we didn't do it earlier. Seriously. This so suits our lifestyle. I also like the lack of sheer 'stuff'. We are still whittling things down, even on board. It's really quite fun. We were warned the first year was the hardest. Now that the first year is almost over, I'll agree with that. I expect things to keep getting easier.

SIde note - we thought we would trade in our rig - a 2001 - once we had some time under our belt. You know, trade up. But we really like our rig, it's just right - and so we're remodeling instead to make it more office-space friendly. Also dumped the LazyBoy recliner for an Ekornes stressless recliner....ahhhhhhhh.....

[tbutler]

Thanks for the post MigrantDawgs! It sounds like you have made a good choice and are comfortable with the lifestyle on wheels. It struck me as interesting that you are in the health field. I was talking with the home nurse visiting to remove the staples from my knee surgery. She commented on our motor home and said she and her husband have always dreamed of doing what we are. I told her that in our years of travel we have met many health professionals who are living and traveling in RV's. It seems to be a profession that is well suited for working and living in an RV.

We moved into a mobile home (ironically not a mobile as our motor home) last fall and I worried that we wouldn't be comfortable going back to the motor home in the spring. It turns out that we're feeling quite at home in the RV for the summer. So we're not full timing any more but we are still living in our motor home when we want.

Like you, our motor home is getting older. We purchased this one after 2 1/2 years on the road in a used motor home. At that point we were sure that we were in this for the long term. We replaced the old pleated curtains and the Norcold refrigerator in our motor home so it is like a new motor home again. In fact, in many respects it's better than new!

Enjoy your travels. If you are so inclined, perhaps you could start a blog and write about your travels. We could use a few more good bloggers.

[theneedforspeed]

I may be in the same boat, except my "full-timing" will likely last only the summer. There are a lot of unanswered questions relating to residency, drivers licenses, medical insurance, et al. Any info you can pass on would be appreciated.

Thanks,

John

[wolfe10]

John,

Welcome to the FMCA Forum.

You will need to give us more details on what your questions are-- many have addressed the same issues.