AIR LEAK / 2014 ITASCA ELLIPSE

[eric@babin.com]

2014 Itasca Ellipse 42QD

We live in coach full time.

We've been stationary for just over two months. When we are stationary for more than a month we always start it up, pull slides in, level, then let slides back out. We do this so we have no surprises when it's time to pull out for a trip. (Well, to minimize the surprises).

Today was our day to start, relevel, and set back up.

We have noticed the passenger side of the coach has always had the air suspension come up slower than the driver's side. In November it actually took about 5 minutes.

Today it was going slow, and didn't quite get to it's normal height, and was significantly lower than the driver's side, especially in the front.

At that time, with engine still running, I noticed we had some sort of air leak coming from the passenger rear axle area, not the tag axle, the one right in front of it. It won't let me attach a video, but the leak is coming from the inside area at the rear axle (not tag) on the passenger side.

When I turned the engine off, air leak continued for a couple of minutes.

We then leveled and the leak stopped. 

We then retracted levelers, bags filled, and I no longer heard an air leak, although, as usual, passenger side took longer to come up.

Brake air gauge steady at 110psi.

We aren't traveling until April so we have a little time. 

Any thoughts on what the leak could be?

I'd assume it's not an airbag since it didn't seem to leak the second time we retracted levelers.

Maybe pressure relief valve got stuck open? 

Other ideas?

Here is a link to the video that I shared on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/792627659547761

 

Edited February 1 by eric@babin.com

[rayin]

Sounds like the rear dump valve is not closing correctly. I had that happen while picking up our MH from Camping World after having the oil N filter changed. The tech came out to the parking  lot, diagnosed the problem, drove the MH back into a bay, replaced the valve, and its been  fine since.

After years of chasing air leaks, those in valves might be easily eliminated, or i've had success with them so far. With the coach up on blocks, empty the compressed air system via the manual moisture drains on the air tanks. The crawl  under, remove the inlet air line to the valve and add a few drops of air tool oil into that inlet line. Then rebuild air pressure and operate the valve several time to distribute the air tool oil.

Normally the dump valves require a 12V signal to open/close, they do not close automatically after dumping, nor open until receiving a 12V signal to the solenoid.

Do not use motor oil!  It contains additives that might deteriorate the O-rings that are sticking.

BTW, your facebook link shows "not available right now".

Edited February 1 by rayin

[wildebill308]

I would read up on setting the ride height. It may be out of adjustment or damaged/detreated.

BTW, your facebook link shows "not available right now".

Bill

[wayne77590]

The air brake gauge seems low to me. My MH's always read 125 psi.

[rayin]

Something that can affect several things, including air pressure is the air dryer; when last was the filter replaced and the unit serviced?  For commercial trucks in use every day the air dryer desiccant filter must be replaced annually. For recreational MH's that is stretched out to 3-4 years depending of amount of use. If you see moisture drain out of the air tanks, the dryer is long-past time for replacement, because if moisture gets into the brake chambers/cans it gets expensive quickly, because the entire compressed air system must be cleaned out.

If you have a Spartan chassis you have 3 air tanks instead of two, of which one is a multi-chamber.

[eric@babin.com]

Update February 10: I have a guy coming take a look at it Monday Feb12. I'll keep everyone updated.

[eric@babin.com]

Today's update: 

Guy from Triad came out to look at air leak.

We got error code on jacks so we ended up having to send him away since we ended up not being able to fill the bags and recreate the leak.

Right now we are pretty sure the jack issue is due to house batteries needing replacement. We're on the original batteries from 2014. (and we've been full timing in it since 2018).

Just ordered 6 batteries, exact replacement NAPA 8831DT. Good news, I suppose, is NAPA is offering 20% off right now, which saved $451!

Once we get those replaced we'll try leveling system again. If that works, we may try to limp into the repair facility. 

[rayin]

DO NOT attempt to drive the MH with air springs deflated, it will ruin one or all of the driveshaft joints, Allison tailpiece bearing, and differential shaft bearing if driven any distance over 20MPH with other than turtle type starts from a dead stop.

Suggest you contact Paul/ AZPETE on the Irv2 forum. He works for HWH and can answer your questions. His email is pfmaddox@att.net and his phone number is 602-549-3638. He is a Commercial Member and has posted that his phone is always on, and if not answered, leave a detailed message with your system model number. He has helped others on this forum and I am sure he can help you.  P.S. He is on mountain time.

This will help you determine your model #

With your model# you can download the service and  troubleshooting manual from the internet.

Edited February 13 by rayin

[eric@babin.com]

On 2/13/2024 at 5:33 AM, rayin said:

DO NOT attempt to drive the MH with air springs deflated, it will ruin one or all of the driveshaft joints, Allison tailpiece bearing, and differential shaft bearing if driven any distance over 20MPH with other than turtle type starts from a dead stop.

Suggest you contact Paul/ AZPETE on the Irv2 forum. He works for HWH and can answer your questions. His email is pfmaddox@att.net and his phone number is 602-549-3638. He is a Commercial Member and has posted that his phone is always on, and if not answered, leave a detailed message with your system model number. He has helped others on this forum and I am sure he can help you.  P.S. He is on mountain time.

This will help you determine your model #

With your model# you can download the service and  troubleshooting manual from the internet.

The airbags do fully inflate and raises to normal ride height. The leak sounds very faint. I will contact him to get some advice. Thank you!

[eric@babin.com]

Today's update:

House batteries have been replaced.

We started coach to see if we still had an air leak and if the jacks would work properly.

Jacks began to work correctly, from the 1/2 up position, the air bags filled, and the jacks retracted. It did sound noisier than normal, but my wife said it was normal sounding. One thing that was strange is when they were fully retracted, as normal you could hear the pump struggle, but usually that is when it stopped and moves on to the next jack. This time the "struggle" sound continued longer than normal, much longer. All jacks did retract. We tried to level at that point, the jacks seemed to work, once all were grounded and it tried to level, we got the "can't complete level" code. We then tried to retract. The airbags emptied, the front began to retract.... very very slowly, but after raising about 4 or 5 inches I got the "return for service" fault. I can clear the code by pressing "enter" and "retract" buttons but the code returns when I try to retract again. 

I've manually retracted via opening valves and putting power drill on pump. All jacks are up, but still getting "Jacks down" alarm. I am not low on fluid. 

 

Edited March 9 by eric@babin.com

[campcop]

What is the make of your hydraulic system? Is it HWH? Retracting jacks does not use hydraulic pressure but uses the springs on the jacks, or least my coaches have. Curious as to why your hydraulic pump is running, if that is what you’re referring to as being noisy.

[eric@babin.com]

2 hours ago, campcop said:

What is the make of your hydraulic system? Is it HWH? Retracting jacks does not use hydraulic pressure but uses the springs on the jacks, or least my coaches have. Curious as to why your hydraulic pump is running, if that is what you’re referring to as being noisy.

No. This is LCI / Lippert. No springs. 

 

[campcop]

Do you have the manual for your jack system? You can download it at the LCI/ Lippert site. It will have trouble shooting guides.

sounds like a defective valve or sensor.

Edited March 9 by campcop

[rayin]

11 hours ago, eric@babin.com said:

The airbags do fully inflate and raises to normal ride height. The leak sounds very faint. I will contact him to get some advice. Thank you!

Sorry for the mix-up. Do not call Paul Maddox, he represents HWH brand leveling systems and slide mechanisms only.

Have you made sure the hydraulic fluid tank is full? I think it takes Dextron III, but check the owners manual to be sure.

Edited March 10 by rayin

[eric@babin.com]

15 hours ago, campcop said:

Do you have the manual for your jack system? You can download it at the LCI/ Lippert site. It will have trouble shooting guides.

sounds like a defective valve or sensor.

Yes..... I'm thinking maybe a bad pressure switch? I'm contacting Lipper this week to troubleshoot.

 

10 hours ago, rayin said:

Sorry for the mix-up. Do not call Paul Maddox, he represents HWH brand leveling systems and slide mechanisms only.

Have you made sure the hydraulic fluid tank is full? I think it takes Dextron III, but check the owners manual to be sure.

Yes, fluid level is full. 

[eric@babin.com]

Today's update / maybe the final?

We were going to take a test drive today to see if we would be able to get it to the shop to check the air leak, and then worry about leveler issues later.

Started coach, it took a very long time to come up to ride height...... maybe about 5-6 minutes..... but it did.

Of course, as mentioned, I had previously raised jacks manually so we would have to worry about that today.... but jacks still showed "jacks down" via the warning light. 

Wife says, "just check the levelers, see what happens, you know how to raise them manually if you have to". 

Turned on leveler control pad.... sure enough they show "jacks down" but they are not. I push "retract" and you can hear it struggling to raise since they are already up.

It doesn't give me any fault code and now shows "jacks up".  OK... .that is good.... shall we be bold enough to try to level?  Sure..... and, guess what..... it worked, fully leveled and shows "success". 

OK..... but what about that pesky air leak?  I can't hear any leak...... no leak? Yep..... no apparent leak.  

Maybe it was the house batteries that needed to be replaced? 

Either way, things are working normal..... .for now.