Batteries Not Charging While Connected to Shore Power

[Rhymmer]

Good evening,

Two months into a new beginning as an owner of an RV.

I am hooked up to a very small campground that supplies 30 amp power to my coach. I am using an adaptor as the coach is wired for 50 amp service.

I have a Xantrex (sp) 458 freedom Inverter that shows my batteries are very low and they are not charging while plugged in.

I came home to a dark coach several nights ago, and one night ago when needing to go outside the steps would not operate.

I have been turning on my engine and running the generator to get power.

However late at night I choose not to run in value of my neighbors.

I have read countless posts, made a few calls, and need help trouble shooting what to do.

I have tried resetting the inverter, pushed the charge and reset buttons and turned off and on both switches.

The button with the 25 on it I pushed in, the inverter let a loud vibrating sounds then kicked this button back out.

Any help/ insight would be appreciated.

Ty

[RVerOnTheMove]

Call Zantrex as soon as possible. They have some good trouble-shooting folks and they should be able to walk you through your options for determining where the issue is. Anytime you are blowing a 25 amp fuse you have a real problem. Do you have the remote monitor? If so, have you tried any of the various setup options? Have you turned the A/C amps options down?

Any other info on what you have done so far?

[Rhymmer]

Ty for the reply.

There is the remote inside the coach. I have the amps set on 30.

I have run the set up several times as instructed by the manual that came with the coach.

I unplugged shore power, unhooked the red wire from the inverter unit and unplugged the telephone cord. Then I waited 5 minutes, re-connceted the red cord,plugged in the phone wire and plugged in shore power. Still the same result.

When I run the engine or generator, the remote indicator says the batteries are at about 13.0 and the led is green.

When I shut off the engine/generator the leds go to orange then red as the decease toward 10.0.

[wolfe10]

Do your other 120 VAC appliances work when plugged into that shore power?

Your inverter/charger should not react any different on shore power than on generator power. So, if it works on generator, but not on shore power, first thing to do is confirm that you do have shore power.

Have you verified you do have shore power-- proper polarity and 108- 128 VAC?

Brett

[Rhymmer]

This is a kind forum. Ty for the feedback.

The fridge works, although one morning I woke up with everything not powered, even the time on the radio by the front dash was blank.

One ac unit will function.

All the lights get dim when the power dies down, which I think to be the batteries loosing power.

I looked at the inverter again and the green light shows a solid green where it says charge/gel.

There is a green light flashing where it says invert/wet.

[shields]

Ty,

Let me add my two cents worth: When you run the genset, the voltage on your indicator is showing the batteries charging at 13 volts; when you shut it down the voltage of 10 volts shows the batteries are fully discharged. So . . . the charger seems to be working, at least when the genset is running. There are a lot of possibilities, but three seem to stand out.

1. You are not getting shore power into the coach. Is there any chance the breaker is tripped on the shore power supply? Have you checked the voltage coming out of the campground pedestal? Let's make sure there is power coming into your coach from the campground supply. If you aren't familiar with 50 amp service, let us know and we will show you how to safely check it with a multitester. For the time being, just plug a drill or lamp into the standard household plug on the pedestal.

2. The batteries are shot, and will not take or hold a charge. How old are the batteries, and what has been their service history?

3. If there is power coming in from the campground supply, and the batteries are still viable (i.e. will take and hold a charge), then we will need to figure out why the Xantrex isn't getting the batteries charged up when connected to shore power. However, I'll bet the answer is either #1 or #2. Let's focus first on 1 and 2. If that doesn't work, let us have some further details and we'll all help you get it straightened out.

Best wishes,

Tim

[dickandlois]

Ty, The Button you push to reset is a circuit breaker. How old are the batteries ? Have you checked the water level in the coach batteries?

Sounds like the circuit breaker is opening due to a short in one of the batteries.

Do you have a meter to check the voltage of each one of the batteries?

Rich.

[Rhymmer]

I will do these steps in the early morning and get back to the forum.

I did purchase an RV power surge protector. It shows the rating at about 120 to 122.

I did trip the system my post on my second day here. I reset the 50 amp breaker, and have been careful to not run too many things at one time.

My gut tells me I am missing something basic, but it could be more involved.

I will trouble shoot tomorrow morning and get back to the board.

Thank you all again.

[RVerOnTheMove]

I don't know the history of your current battery bank, but if I had batteries that showed a strong voltage while on the charger but 10.0V when not charging I would have to make the leap that the batteries are completely shot! If you know more about the batteries history you may be able to dispute that assumption (you know what they say about assume) but a battery bank that takes a 13+V charge for an extended period but shows 10V when the charger is disconnected indicates that the batteries (one or more) is dead, dead, dead.

[vtbigdog]

...or they are our of water

[wolfe10]

...or they are our of water

Yup, if plates are exposed, they are as good as dead.

[Rhymmer]

Good afternoon.

Here is where I am.

Shore power works.

Batteries start the generator.

The Inverter works fine with the generator running.

With the engine running the batteries charge.

Where is the switch over point from using the generator to using the shore power 110?

Could there be a bad solenoid (sp) switch?

Thank you very much.

[wolfe10]

Generator and shore power both feed into an ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) that allows only ONE source of 120 VAC at a time.

Then wires run from the ATS to the 120 VAC main breaker box.

Trace shore power wire from side of coach to ATS is usually the easiest, OR from breaker box back to ATS.

Brett

[Rhymmer]

Good afternoon from rainy Florida.

I ran my generator and the batteries do NOT charge while it is running. I mis-spoke in an earlier post.

What I am understanding is the automatic transfer switch (ATS) allows 120 current to flow from the generator or shore power.

Where is this ATS switch located?

With the shore power and generator BOTH not charging the batteries, would this signal an issue with the inverter?

Is there a circuit board or fuse inside the inverter itself that could be tested?

What an experience this has been.

Ty

[wolfe10]

Yes, shore power and generator "meet" at the ATS. But, as long as other 120 VAC appliances such as the A/C's are working, you DO have 120 VAC at least to the main 120 VAC breaker panel.

There are a number of acceptable ways that your inverter (or hopefully inverter/charger) could be wired.

Start by turning off and back on the breaker in your main 120 VAC breaker panel for the inverter. Yes, most inverters and inverters DO have a fuse or often resettable breaker on the inverter itself. Check for one. But, be aware that a bad battery could also be the cause and could be DANGEROUS.

After that, suggest you contact the tech help line for your brand inverter with the model and serial number for more specific troubleshooting.

In the meantime, you can plug in any 12 VDC charger to a 120 VAC outlet to bring your batteries back up. If in a CG, I guarantee you that someone near you has one you could borrow. Worse case is use your toad with jumper cables to the coach batteries (set RPM around 1200-1500) OR use the coach main engine to charge both banks.

Brett

[Rhymmer]

Brett,

Thank you. The inverter/charger is a Xantrex 458 Freedom model.

I have flipped the breaker box for the inverter back off and on. I have flipped off and on the two breaker switches on the outside of the inverter.

I will call them first thing Monday to troubleshoot before an appt. with an RV dealer.

Just wanting now to have this issue solved, but have enjoyed the learning curve and becoming more informed each time.

I appreciate this posting board and all who have given their time.

[RVerOnTheMove]

Does your 458 have the remote panel where you can see what's going on and make changes to the inverter/charger setup?

It should have 4 buttons at the bottom. Setup, Charge, Invert, Power Share.

[Rhymmer]

Yes it has the remote. The remote say batteries are low.

When I run the engine for 20-30 min the batteries move up one level from the low reading.

On the inverter/charger itself, I attempt to press in the 25 button, the inverter makes a loud noise and vibrates and kicks out the 25 button in about 10-15 seconds.

I turn on the engine to get a battery boost back up.

I have been using propane to heat my hot water as the shore power with 30 amps for a 50 amp system is not heating.

Shore power does allow me to run one ac and also the microwave, but not both at the same time.

This is all new to me, but am learning a great deal. Full timing now for a little more than two months.

[wolfe10]

Sounds like you have identified the issue as either a problem with the inverter or the batteries. Have you checked battery water level? Voltage? Are the sides of the battery swollen?

If not a battery issue, call Xantrex on Monday.

But, you might try turning off all other 120 VAC appliances (A/C, microwave, water heater if 120 VAC element) and re-try the inverter/charger.

If the CG has low voltage, running everything at the same time may drop voltage below sustainable levels. Again, I suspect an internal issue with the inverter/charger, but this 5 minute test would be worth trying.

[RVerOnTheMove]

Since you have the remote panel you have a lot of information and options at your finger tips. Are there any lights blinking (none should)? When you push the Charge button does it light? Where do you have your power share set? When plugged into shore power, does the Invert button blink on/off (opps, one blinking light is OK)?

What lights are lit where it shows A/C in, Fault, Overtemp?

Do you have the owners manual and if so have you been through it to ensure it's setup correctly?

Can you get the cover off in it's current location (danger! 120V!).

[dickandlois]

Ty ! Bill and Brett are correct in their information.

However ! you have a Bad or Bad batteries !!!! I'm concerned that you could have one of them explode on you. This is a safety issue

The generator starts off the chassis batteries.

The charger / inverter is powered from the 120 volts supplied from shore power or the generator. The reset you are pushing is rated at 25 amps. and trips because it sees a short in the coach batteries.

The reason that your coach batteries charge when the engine is running is because the positive feed from the alternator is fused (or should be at between 100 to 150 amps) that much current into a bad battery can over heat it and it could explode !!!!!!

This issue must be cleared up before you try to drive the coach home !!! The worst case(s) are a battery that Blows Up or you fry the alternator adding to the repair cost.

If you are not sure how to check the batteries for the proper water levels and voltage, just ask for help from another camper at the camp ground. Pay attention to how the cables are connected, ether with good notes and drawings,a few pictures or better yet both.

We have all been on your learning curve at some point and I want you to be safe and enjoy yourself.

Rich.

[Briarhopper]

Yes it has the remote. The remote say batteries are low.

When I run the engine for 20-30 min the batteries move up one level from the low reading.

On the inverter/charger itself, I attempt to press in the 25 button, the inverter makes a loud noise and vibrates and kicks out the 25 button in about 10-15 seconds.

The breaker tripping indicates over current in the inverter/charger output.

Questions:

Have you ever been hooked up to a 50 amp shore line and if so, was all working properly as fas as you know?

During the current stay, has the shore power cut off for any length of time? You mentioned tripping the breaker the second day??

When the 458 breaker (button with 25 on it) trips, are you connected to shore power or generator or neither?

Is the chg/gel light still showing green and invert/wet light still blinking?

BH

[Rhymmer]

Rain rain rain here today. I am determined to find the issue and have it resolved. I will call Xantrex in the morning and talk with them.

I will be able to have an intelligent problem solving conversation much in part from this board.

To be continued.

I will post sometime tomorrow afternoon.

Have a great day today.

[Briarhopper]

The LEDs described indicate the 458 was set to charge and inverter in standby mode. If shore power dropped out, the inverter automatically trys to pick up the load. If the load was too much for the shore breaker, it would be too much for the 458 (25 button) breaker.

[Briarhopper]

I looked at the inverter again and the green light shows a solid green where it says charge/gel.

There is a green light flashing where it says invert/wet.

The LEDs described indicate the 458 was set to charge and inverter in standby mode. If shore power dropped out, the inverter automatically trys to pick up the load. If the load was too much for the 458 the (25 button) breaker would then trip.

While the breaker is tripped, the 458 will not charge the batteries from shore power or generator.

If the breaker only trips when not connected to shore power it is likely due to the inverter load.

Turn the inverter off by pressing the invert button once (invert/wet LED should go off and not blink) and see if the breaker (25 button) will reset.