jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 My exhaust fan in the kitchen lost the power side of its circuit. The only two items on this circuit are the bathroom fan and kitchen fan, bathroom works. I pulled the shrouds down and there's a black wire (hot) coming off of the bathroom fan which I can only assume it goes across the ceiling to the kitchen, however the positive wire in the kitchen is red, which tells me there is a splice somewhere. So in a traditional RV build would the wire go across the ceiling in a tunnel? If so how do you access it? I have pulled all lighting fixtures down to see and they all dead end in a wooden box just above. We have a vinyl ceiling does that come down for access or would it be damaged? I thought about opening up the wood between the vinyl and the roof (6" deep, just cut a hole) where the shroud slides up and taking a peek to see where the wires go. If I lightly pull them I can hear what sounds like a butt connector slapping in the top side of the ceiling. Thought? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Joe. Guessing the black line goes to a junction box and a red to celling fan and exhaust fan. Are they straight across from each other? Or is it bathroom, celling then a right or left turn to kitchen...can you draw it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Check the DC fuse box and see if the 20 amp fuse for the fan controller failed. The drawings I have show the Galley fan on its own fuse? White is ground - purple and black is hot through the speed control. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Joe, I don't remember which roof you have, rubber or fiberglass, the rubber ones traditionally used two layers of 3/4 plywood, the wire traces were routed with a wood router on the top side of the bottom layer, wires were laid in then top layer placed over that. Fiberglass was after my time of building. A fox and hound as Rich calls it, will come in handy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted May 19, 2017 It might be possible to use the bad wire to pull a new wire through. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Yes, but from what point do you pull and how do you find that point.. Kay, he has a fiberglass roof. Bill, how's the Storms around you? Wind in Weatherford is up to 70+ and my coach was doing a serious Rock and Roll for 6 hours! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Joe, See if you can get your hands on a circuit tracing tool ! Need more info. let me know. The system has 2 parts. One puts a tone on the wire you want to trace and find out where it goes and how it gets there. The second part is a receiver that allows you to fallow the tone the wire is emitting. The first try or two will be a learning curve, but with practice one can get fairly proficient. Understand - they are not all created equal, so if you can barrow one from an IT or audio insulation service. Good. Can you find a rental or get one on a trial bases. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
desertdeals69 Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Check to see if the ground is good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 I tried to tug on it and see if it moved in the bathroom, no such luck. Monaco loves wire loom and wire loom anchors that are usually screwed to something. Its great to protect them, horrible when you need to pull new wires or air lines through. My bathroom fan is on the passenger side of the coach and my kitchen is on the drivers side, only 3' toward the refrigerator and 3' back is the bathroom. Here's the interior, if you look up you can see daylight, that is the kitchen fan hole. walk through the door way toward the back and turn left is the Bathroom where the other fan is located. What's odd is the wires come into the fan box on the kitchen counter side, you would think if they were actually coming from the bathroom they would come into the box on that side. DD, ground is good! I connected my Power Probe and checked both sides of the circuit, when I sent power to the positive wire the fan controller turned on. I wish it was a ground problem, that would be easy to rerun. Rich, both fans are on the same fused circuit according to the wiring diagram I have and the fuse panel is labeled as such. "Bathroom and Kitchen fans 12VDC, Fuse #4, 15 Amp" is how its labeled and one wire coming out for power off of the fuse box. I think when I get home I will see if I can snake my bore scope into the hole where the wires come through and see what's up in the ceiling and where those wires go. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Any thoughts on pulling the ceiling down for access, anyone ever attempt that? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Joe, in most RV's the ceiling is glued to foam which in turn is glued to the plywood backing. A decorative channel would the easiest. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 OMG, just thought of something while looking at the photo...cant believe I missed it! On the kitchen slide is the old fan thermostat, I wonder if the problem is in that old switch box? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Thanks Kay! It does have the snap up channel between sections, you could hide wiring along it easily, just not my preference for proper routing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Well also one other thought is more likely a poor connection at the junction in the bathroom since that one works, as said earlier a wire signal probe would be your best friend for testing right now, https://www.lowes.com/pd/Southwire-Analog-Tone-and-Probe-Meter/50278117. E-mail me if you are not familiar, ebay has them even cheaper if not in too big of a hurry. Very unlikely that the wire is broken, but there are first. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 When we bought the coach it originally had a kitchen fan that looked like something from a food truck on the roof (motor was seized, big ugly metal thing), the old thermostat is on the wall and the switch is glued to the ON position. I tried to bypass it and throw it out when I replaced the fan, but there is a large hole behind it so it was left there. Wonder if it failed internally....? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Kay, the last coach had some crazy wiring nightmares, I am actually surprised it didn't burn to the ground. I found a 120 volt outlet that had a wood screw going through the romex above the couch (outlet didn't work when we bought it) Several 12v butt connectors not crimped properly that came apart in the walls and below cabinets in the channels. Coachmen didn't believe in loom or anchors, so when they were running screws through stuff it wasn't uncommon to hit a wire or two along the way . I got pretty good chasing electrical problems in that coach. This one has been solid with wiring....well so far anyway. I'm betting the old wall Stat died as the ceiling fan in the kitchen is still looped through it now that I think about it, I completely forgot that was still part of the circuit. Funny how you sit and stare at a photo and the light bulb turns on in your head Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Most likely! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 The tool in the link looks like a neat gadget to have! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 It is, I use mine on the job about 3 or more times a week. Simply put one lead onto one wire, the other lead onto the other, turn it on and a signal is generated. The other device has a probe that will read that signal and produce a sound, some of them are a pulsing sound some solid, doesn't matter which. anyway, the probe does not have to come in complete contact with the wire meaning you can actually follow the wires through a thin wall, not metal of course, this allows you to determine where the wire is broken if it is. We use them for pulling network wires through an entire building from a home location without labeling the wires, then toning them out to identify each wire when done. The phone company's have been using them for years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Kay, I'm surprised that more of the RV service centers do not have them. I have one that can be used for both AC and DC circuits, but it works better in AC applications and not all that bad for DC circuits. Also can be used for finding underground wires and how deep they are and can be used on hot AC circuits.One can find those pesky wiring problems that pop up using the spring contacts on outlets and light switches. They can find that hidden GFI location. LOL. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Yep, when I was building my house 20 + years ago, I introduced the electrical inspector to mine, he was surprised that there was such an animal, and assured me that he would own one before the sun set. Mine is not as sophisticated as yours and I will attach it to a live DC circuit, but not a live AC. The one at Lowes is $40.00 but on ebay have seen them for less than $20.00. Anyone that attempts to do their own wire trouble shooting really needs one and learn how to use it, not hard but a little practice makes one an electricians best friend. Here is the search url on ebay so that you can see the many choices, I use Tripp Lite. http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xwiring+tone+generator.TRS0&_nkw=wiring+tone+generator&_sacat=0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Well, it was the old thermostat. A wire popped off of the circuit board inside. I bypassed it all together. And put it back to cover the hole. Not sure why I didn't do that in the first place Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted May 19, 2017 Sometimes the simple things are the hardest to see. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted May 20, 2017 YUP, especially when they are not in the schematic and you forget they exist Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted May 21, 2017 Geez! Just followed Kay's link. Forgot that I bought one about 8 years ago and my friend had one and used it on my 2007 WB Tour, so I never used mine! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
