Decision: Winnebago Tour, Newmar Dutchstar or Tiffin Allegro Bus

[shapoe]

I am trying to decide among a Winnebago Tour, Newmar Dutchstar and Tiffin Allegro Bus. 

All similar configurations, all tag axles,

What is the general impression of ride, quietness, handling, quality control, frequency of recalls or problems. 

Any advice much appreciated.

[CarlAda]

I recently drove a 2016 Dutchstar and I have to say that I was very impressed with the comfort steer system.  The ride was a bit firmer than I'm used to with our Country Coach, but very acceptable and a treat to drive mainly due to the steering.  It handled curves well and was relatively quiet, even with the generator running while we were driving.  I didn't care for the lack of walking space with the slides retracted in the Dutchstar that I was looking at (don't recall the model).  

[shapoe]

Thank you for your prompt reply.  I'll look again at the space in the Dutchstar but I recall something similar in terms of tightness

 

[CarlAda]

As I recall, my biggest complaint about when the slides were in was focused on our dogs being able to move about.  While my DW could maneuver back to the bathroom and reefer with some effort, it was just a tight fit and there was really no room on the floor for the dogs to lie down because of the deeper slides and the way the slides raised up to retract.  I believe it was the 4369 model that we were considering.  Guess I'm spoiled by my current coach.

[wildebill308]

That is one thing to always check when looking at coaches. Always have the slides brought in to check if you can get to the important stuff. The deeper the slides the further they come in to the center of the coach. 

Bill

[jleamont]

I'm betting the floor plan selection would help or hurt the interior when closed up on any make, just look at them closed up carefully. We toured a new Dutchstar (I believe it was a 4369) at a campground last August. New found FMCA friends.... I was impressed at the quality and the fact they had the unit for a month and just returned from a month long trip, not a single problem with the unit, in todays market that in of itself was IMPRESSIVE! The other item that my jaw dropped on was the engine compartment layout, it was huge and plenty of room for servicing, the rear hatches opened up with more than adequate space inside and outside. One thing to keep in mind while shopping, it will need maintenance and repairs, if its not accessible its going to cost you a fortune to repair and maintain.

Overall it was a very nice coach, not built as solid as they once were but overall seemed like a good choice to me.

I have nothing good to say about the other two especially the T one, I will leave it at that.

 

[shapoe]

OK - for several reasons, I've eliminated the Tiffin Allegro Bus from consideration.

Now I'm trying to decide between a fully loaded 2017 Tour 42qd and a Newmar 4018.  Very similar layouts and reasonably close in options and specifications. I've used the NADA guide and do not seen an appreciable difference in resale % over time. Prices are close.

Guidance please:  quality, comfort of ride, quietness in coach, both have passive TAG and both have IFS.  Any other factors I should consider.

 

Thanks to all.

 

[manholt]

Quote

 

I can't speak for the Tour of today, but same amount of $$$ you have Itasca, always have been a better fit and finish!  That said, I have looked at the new Dutch Star and Vantana by Newmar.  My lady likes the Vantana, I go with Dutch Star for 2 reasons...choice of Spartan Chassis and 450 Cummins...Vantana is on Freightliner chassis and 400 Cummins.  All 400 series have the same 1250 torque, you just get there a little quicker with the 450 and having had both chassis, I like the ride of Spartan the best.  As for slides in on any big DP built after 2009, will have the dogs on a couch.  Been there, currently there again!

My Lady, will probably get the Vantana 40 foot, tag, when we get to Indy in July...makes her happy, I'm happy!  Besides, not my $$$.

Carl

[shapoe]

New thought - cannot go to 45 feet due to storage limitations.  I can buy a 2017 Grand Tour (43 feet) at almost the same price as a Newmar Dutchstar of similar size. 

Any thoughts about fit, finish, ride, quality, etc.

[rtdavew]

One big difference is radiator placement I believe the Tour is rear versus side on DS. As noted about make sure you are comfortable with how livable the units are with the slides in. I do think Newmar has the highest initial quality by a fair amount. Also when you look at the used market there are far fewer Newmars than either Winne or Tiffin. I know if it was my money I would go Dutch Star because of comfort drive.

[CarlAda]

1 hour ago, rtdavew said:

One big difference is radiator placement I believe the Tour is rear versus side on DS. 

I just looked at a 2017 Tour that just came from the Junction City factory (Old Country Coach facility) and the newer models sport a side radiator (45 foot model with 450 HP motor) I believe that this is a change for the new model year.

[BillAdams]

You should contact David Bott.  He bought a Tour and then had Winebago take it back.  He now owns a Tiffin.  You can contact him via his website http://www.outsideourbubble.com/ or he is an active poster on the Tiffin RV Forum.

[shapoe]

What am I missing ?  Looked at the Dutchstar 4369 or 4381 - rides nice but I liked the steering set to 3-4 rather than down in the 1-2 range.  Really tight when closed- about 14" barely got refrig door opened; door to 1/2 bath nicely designed to permit access.  Here is the big difference - where is the storage room.  In the coach virtually every cabinet was smaller than my Journey (36M) and less of them (although the wood was quite nice).  And in the basement - almost no storage.

We are occasional users, far from full time, but cannot imagine how anyone can store stuff in a Dutchstar.  What am I missing?

Also, I went back to a year's worth of recall notices on competing brands and the clear "winner" was Newmar Dutchstar with recalls almost EVERY MONTH.  Neither Tiffin nor Winnebago had many. Again, is this silly to look at things this way? Thanks everyone for your advice.  I'm only into this for 1 1/2 years.

Lastly, what is the significance of a side radiator.  And how important is it to have passive tag axle.

 

 

[Corona4me]

Our Old School Dutchstar has plenty storage, The Tag if for all the unnecessary bling they push on the "New" buyers...Parked with a couple that own a Winnie Tour (new) they had it for 7 months, it spent 4 in the shop, they weren't happy! Less maintenance with a side radiator.

[abyrd]

The side radiator provide better access to the engine for repairs,  doesn't much difference for routine maintenance.

 

Jim

[manholt]

Sorry to say this.  If you want access to everything, inside and out, while your on the road?  Get a coach without slides!  The coach of today, come with 3 or 4 slides...your coach is 101.5 or 102 inches wide on exterior and an average of 98 inches interior...you do the math!  You can't have it both ways. 

I find that I get less dirt and grime on the back off coach, better air flow with a side radiator.  As far as keeping the radiator and CAC clean, rear is easier.  Getting at engine for service, then side is more cost effective.

As for the original question.  I would go with the Newmar Vantana, 40 foot.  My significant other want's a new DP, pre Chandler Rally, she was looking at a 45 foot bath and a half with 4 slide coach...she currently has a 40 foot DP 3 slide Tiffin.  She fell in love with everything the Vantana had to offer in a 40, including tag.  As far as Big Bang for the Bucks, I agree!  My first Class A was a Winnebago a nice, new 1967.  My second DP was a new 2007 Tour 40 foot, POS that spent a lot of months in a shop over a 5 year period...as the years go by, a brand name changes and mostly, not for the better!  Same with Tiffin, been there and got the T shirt. 

shapo.  you want a 43 foot, OK.  In another Post I wrote about twist an torque.  Your going to want a really strong, cross braced, chassis, like the K2 or K3 by Spartan to minimize the torque!  That puts you in Newmar...my humble 2 cents worth. 

Carl

[pmsaran]

I do not have a horse in this race, but we have friends with a 2016 Winnebago 37 DP and it has spend more time back

at the dealer than in their hands.  In July they will drop it off at the factory for more rework.  with slide in you can see daylight.

Phil Saran

Colorado

[BSMEATON]

Our favorite by far was the Tour 42QD and the Grand Tour would be just awesome for us.  We found the Meridian/Tour 42E worked for us in feature/value with close to the same layout as the 42QD, but doesn't mean I wouldn't love to jump at a the Tour if it financially made sense for us as vacationers.

We also loved the richness of the Allegro Bus, but almost a little too ornate for us and we could never find a floor plan we liked for the living room.

Dutch Star was also a beautiful coach, and they did have a floorplan similar to the 42QD in the living room, but we never found one that matched what we wanted in floor plan.  

We have the Tag and it is simply an issue of weight - the tag supports the extended length of our bath and 1/2 and makes the rear axles rated for 30,000 lbs.  Handling wise it is a treat to drive.  We did not drive the Comfort Drive Newmar, but understand the concept and there are some aftermarket products that will get you close if it is a requirement.  We did drive several Spartan versus Freightliner chassis and I honestly couldn't tell the difference, but we aren't necessarily seasoned.  I know there is a lot of hoopla about side radiators, but in the end for us the rear radiator serves well and our shop has never complained about it for service (which has been maintenance, no repair).  I suppose if push came to shove the side radiator may be easier to put on a belt and may be cheaper for some maintenance, but in the scheme of things I wouldn't let that be a show stopper.

For every brand there are stories of the dreaded "time in the shop" but without qualification (was it the chassis, the coach, the appliance) it is hard to make judgement.  Many share the same chassis, and almost all share the same appliances.  Was it in the shop for a long time because it had so many issues, or was it because the shop had a 12 week lag time and blamed part accessibility on the manufacturer to overcome the fact he pushed all his new sale preps in front of yours?  Hard to ever tell without the facts.

[five]

Floor plan is key, most of the other characteristics of these three (and American Coach) should be about the same.