Allowing Towables Vote At Indianapolis In July

[hayesfamily]

  On 5/26/2017 at 9:58 AM, manholt said:

Said it before, we have not had a noticeable decline in revenue, in the past 4 years

So Carl I have to ask the question, if we have not had a decline in income what is the point of voting to allow towables or not?

I was under the impression that FMCA was on a ridiculous decline as far as membership dues thus voting to allow towables was the way to solve that.

Are there are several reasons to increase membership, one being Revenue, the other being membership numbers to maybe say we're the biggest, but the other very crucial reason is so that you have a knowledge database. If FMCA is not hurting for money and not really being too affected by the reduction in numbers what is the real reason that people are squawking?

[dons2346]

  On 5/28/2017 at 12:56 PM, HayesFamily said:

So Carl I have to ask the question, if we have not had a decline in income what is the point of voting to allow towables or not?

I was under the impression that FMCA was on a ridiculous decline as far as membership dues thus voting to allow towables was the way to solve that.

Are there are several reasons to increase membership, one being Revenue, the other being membership numbers to maybe say we're the biggest, but the other very crucial reason is so that you have a knowledge database. If FMCA is not hurting for money and not really being too affected by the reduction in numbers what is the real reason that people are squawking?

The only ones squawking are a few on the executive board. It has been determined that a membership of 50-70,000 is enough to sustain FMCA. Dues might have t go up but it is possible without having towables. The magazine used to be the big money maker but revenue has fallen in recent times however the magazine staff hasn't changed one bit! The only thing that has been cut is the office staff which is utterly stupid..

Think about this for a minute. Look how this has been presented to the membership and the governing board. It has been presented as a "must have to do" or we will fail. As far as I know, there has been zero studies done to determine even if towables want or will join. Venues that do have motorhomes such as dog shows, horse shows, etc have not been approached with a booth extolling the greatness of FMCA. It has been said that the marketing company hired by FMCA spent $264,000 on advertising and recruitment. Where was it spent? The $250,000 given to rVillage was not included in that amount.

So Hayes Family, don't give up yet. There is a chance that the membership will not have to vote on this.It depends on what happens during the GB meeting

[wildebill308]

  On 5/28/2017 at 7:54 AM, manholt said:

Isaaac1.  Glad you chimed in...your points are appreciated and well thought out.

Bill.  The odds of anyone, thinking that you don't belong to FMCA, at a FMCA rally is Slim and None!  Just like at a GS rally..., Have never had anyone try to recruit me.

Ross.  X3

Herman.  Point taken!  Is that also in ref to Article 2 ?

Carl

Carl, I was parked a long ways from the FMCA groupe, so they didn't see my oval. I also didn't have on my FMCA shirt or anything to make them think I was with them. I can guarantee that if you are walking in the area around a RRR get together you will have someone speak to you and invite you to "happy hour".

I must have looked to pore/scruffy and a like a tow behind owner to those rich people who had the big busses. 

Bill

[manholt]

  Quote

 

Bill.  Triple R is a FMCA Chapter, if they are at a Rally with other FMCA members...of course they will invite folks in...Lone Stare and all the others do the same!  We all look "Scruffy" at a big Rally!

Keon.  I think some one or a group of folks, will make personal gain, if we open to all RV's...only explanation that makes any kind of sense!  How or Why?  I don't know!!! 

[wildebill308]

  On 5/28/2017 at 7:24 PM, manholt said:

Bill.  Triple R is a FMCA Chapter, if they are at a Rally with other FMCA members...of course they will invite folks in...Lone Stare and all the others do the same!  We all look "Scruffy" at a big Rally!

Keon.  I think some one or a group of folks, will make personal gain, if we open to all RV's...only explanation that makes any kind of sense!  How or Why?  I don't know!!! 

We always do well at FMCA functions. I think they picked up 8 new members/coaches at 6 state. I am talking about when we are someplace outher than a FMCA function. The 8th to 11th of June they will be at The Choctaw KOA and I bet they recruit a  couple new members from the people camped there.  

All you have to do is say HI. This is not being promoted effectively by FMCA as the parent organization.

Bill

 

[hayesfamily]

  On 5/28/2017 at 3:26 PM, dons2346 said:

Think about this for a minute. Look how this has been presented to the membership and the governing board. It has been presented as a "must have to do" or we will fail. As far as I know, there has been zero studies done to determine even if towables want or will join.

The reason why I asked about the squawking is because of an experience I had this past weekend. This past weekend I went camping and everybody who had a fifth wheel trailer or some type of towable trailer looked at me and kind of treated me as if I was the third world citizen because my coach was an all-in-one unit. I'm not sure if they felt that I felt I was better than them or they may have felt that they were better than me I don't know but the bottom line is allowing towables seems like that would be asinine with all due respect to the board, not trying to say that they are idiots by any means. However, it is very obvious that we do not have any similarities with a towable other than the fact that some of our systems that may mirror one another but the lifestyle is completely different. I'm not saying one is any better than the other but I'm pretty sure the response I got from the guys with the fifth wheels and the towable trailers is a response that everybody has gotten over the years they have had a Class A B or C RV.

It's almost the equivalent of inviting a Democrat nominee to the Republican National Convention knowing that they're not going to share the same ideologies political interest that a republican would so in other words I guess what I'm saying is you're asking for trouble.

[wildebill308]

I am with you Keon, I don't see any tow behinds trying to beat down the doors at FMCA trying to get in. I think if it passes you won't see any change. This could be some kind of a scheme to justify raising dues significantly.  "well we did everything we could, even let towables into our hallowed halls."

Bill

[manholt]

Linda and I have friends with 5th wheels, trailers and even one casita.  We don't have any friction between us, in regards to what we camp in!  We all have membership in GS and Escapees!  Where the difference lies, is that they have no interest in FMCA.  We, the members of FMCA, seem to be the ones that gravitate to GS and Escapees!

From reading the many comments, that's been posted here over the last 8 months, I'm beginning to feel that it's a, demographic issue. 

Keon.  How many Class A's or C's was at that campground?  In your part of the Country, you might be running into class envy!

Since FMCA is none profit...I see no difference in a membership of 500 or 500,000.  the year end balance sheet, has still got to read zero, in order to retain our 'Not for Profit" status!  If FMCA want to bring down the cost of membership, then delete Assist and let those who want it, pay their own...GS it's $109 a year!   

[jleamont]

Anyone read the June 2017 FMCA magazine? It's setting us up for it in a few articles  . The one was so far out it made me laugh.

We experience the same problem Keon experienced and we experience it often! I'm not saying all towables are occupied by people like that but not all motorhomes are occupied by retired snobby people either. we are labeled as such up in the NE anyway. The majority of them will not speak to you if you make the first attempt. The motorhome people were congregation in the road chatting about where they came from, places we want to go while the towable people were at their site and kept to themselves. It's night and day up here. You get smiles and good mornings from the motorhome people and shrugs from 95% of the towable people. The other 5% are young families that have their sights set on a motorhome in the future and have questions. 

Very divided in the North East with not much in common and nothing here in benefits to attract them. We have friends with trailers, they carry NO memberships for any group unless it's FREE. 

[hermanmullins]

Jim,

A side story about driving in Texas.

"A salesman was in El Paso and called his home office in Chicago. The home office said that since he was in Texas would he jump up to Texarkana and see a customer. Which the salesman replied "Why don't you drop down and see the customer, you are 20 miles closer then I am.'"

[jleamont]

  On 5/29/2017 at 12:00 PM, hermanmullins said:

Jim,

A side story about driving in Texas.

"A salesman was in El Paso and called his home office in Chicago. The home office said that since he was in Texas would he jump up to Texarkana and see a customer. Which the salesman replied "Why don't you drop down and see the customer, you are 20 miles closer then I am.'"

[manholt]

 X2

[isaaac1]

That is a good example to illustrate the size of Texas, another is that the East or West Sides of Texas are closer to the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans respectively than they are to each other.

[manholt]

where in SW LA you at?

[isaaac1]

I am in the DeRidder area about 45 miles north of Lake Chares

[tbutler]

I've stated my position on this issue.  We can always complain about how money in an organization is spent.  The complaints only have impact if you are an elected official or talking to an elected official.  So if you want to complain about FMCA expenditures, get the facts and then talk to those who can make changes.  If you want to change the way the organization is run, put your name on the ballot.

Membership numbers translate to more dues money, they also relate to the prices for advertising in the magazine or here on the website.  Advertisers want to know how many members their advertising will reach.  If the numbers are too low, advertisers can't justify spending big dollars.  The numbers also impact the costs and revenue from events like the national conventions.  If convention attendance drops, fewer vendors will show up at conventions and meetings. 

All these things impact dues.  The less revenue from these other sources, the more that must come from dues.  It's that or you start paring the organization back.  Some members could pay more for membership while others would not be happy to see their benefits cut back in order to keep dues the same.  So as pinch comes to shove, some will pay more in dues while others will drop out because benefits that they see as important are no longer offered or are at a cheaper rate through another organization.

My sense is that the industry is in decline due to high costs of ownership, particularly for the most complex RV's, our motor homes.  Couple this with fuel prices that were above $4.00 per gallon at times in recent years.  The state of the economy following the 2008 collapse compounded the situation.  Numerous manufacturers dropped out of the market, some restructured, and those still in the market frequently cut back their production and the number of models they offer.  As the industry goes, so goes FMCA.

There is a counter to some of the above.  As the number of motor homes in service declines the bond between motor home owners becomes stronger.  This could be a way of maintaining membership.  My favorite example of this effect is meeting someone from you home state when you are in a foreign country.  Suddenly you have a connection with someone who in most cases you would never even stop to talk to.  Think about it.  If you hear someone in your local Walmart says they are from your home state do you break into the conversation to say, so am I?  But if you are in France, they are suddenly your new best friend. 

[gulya]

Instead of bloviating get out there and recruit. If you really like FMCA talk it up every where you see a motorhome or encounter a motorhome owner. 

[dons2346]

Not to sure about the RV industry being in the tank. A month ago lead time for a new Villa couch was 10 weeks, this past week it is now out to 16 weeks. I also got a bid for a new paint job and the first time I can get it done is during the Dec through March time frame.

There is a huge market for older coach remodels because a lot of the new coaches are full of fuu fuu and no substance

[isaaac1]

I suspect there is a trailing edge effect from the 2008 economic downturn when it comes to the number of motorhomes on the road as that production gap in 2008-2013 or so models trickles its way down the used market.  Leaving a supply gap of recent model used units and older good condition units.

[wildebill308]

  On 5/30/2017 at 3:43 AM, Isaaac1 said:

 

I suspect there is a trailing edge effect from the 2008 economic downturn when it comes to the number of motorhomes on the road

 

I doubt this is a significant number when compared to the total number on the road. I still don't see that many Class "C" or "B" coaches at events.

In Chandler I don't recall seeing any class C coaches and only a few B coaches. Some one has the numbers.  Management needs to stop making excuses and start getting the job done.

Bill 

[isaaac1]

Perhaps the lack of class B and class C owners may again be due to a set of benefits that primarily appeal to full timers and snow birders who tend to own class A's with their larger size and greater cargo capacity.

[jimnorm]

My only real comment on growth vs allowing towables is this. Local Chapters need to be where we grow. We've been members for ten years. Last year we finally got the time to attend an Annual. We have yet to make any chapter rally. We did join one but our schedules never seemed to align, often they were scheduled for the week, not the weekend. If we are looking for more and particularly younger members we need to pay attention to this. KIDS go to school during hte week, Adults generally WORK during the week. Summers are the prime time for RV use. A rally in early spring with kids in school likely means that school sports conflict. Same for fall. Expecting parents and kids to travel outside of a few non-summer weeks is a false hope. Growth will not be found inthe 60-80 age group. I hate to say this, but we older people are a dead end. I'm 64 so I figure I can probably RV for maybe 15 more years, I might be a lucky one and have 20 years. I know I don't have 30 or 40. We need to find a way to attract people that are south of 50, better yet, south of 40. Then you have prospects of 40+ year members. It may sound a bit harsh, but life is at times harsh. The reality is we need people to replace the ones that have left us. and the younger we get them, the longer we have them.

[wildebill308]

My point is if they can't attract significant numbers of "C" owners who tend to be younger. How are they going to attract owners of pull behinds? The "B" class coaches tend to be more expensive and more likely owned by people downsizing. But there again they arn't doing a good job of attracting them. 

Bill

[jimnorm]

Bill, I agree. We have not tapped nearly all the owners of self-propelled RVs. If we have been told NO but everyone that drives their RV then we have to consider two things, A) What aren't we offering that would attract them? and B). Why not? If we can't attract all the non- members that drive, why do we think we'll be successful attracting and retaining members from the tow-behind segment of the industry?

[manholt]

Majority of Snow Birders that I see rolling down I-95 or I-75 or I-35 to Hwy 77S are not in big Class A's!  Lot's of B's, some C's and also Class A gassers.  Maybe 15% are DP's of 40 foot plus!  That's of the Motor Homes...Towable is 4 to one against Coaches!  Back to demographics!

FMCA has never been a large club...Since it's beginning, 50+ years ago we have only issued 458,000+ F#'s and 2,500+ L#'s!  We never re-issue some one else's # unless it's to a family member!  What has changed all of a sudden in the last 2 years?