Oil Bath Hubs

[hermanmullins]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

This got carried over on to Ray's Posting on the retiring of his coach. Sorry.

I need to ask for more information on the Oil Bath Hubs. Joe said that he has added Oil Bath Hubs to his steering wheels. Are your front hubs packed with standard Wheel Bearing Grease? And if so do you have to clean the grease from the bearings and inside the hubs before adding the oil bath hubs?

If so and I decide to do so that sounds like the ideal time for new seals and brake pads.

I am quite familiar with both front wheel bearings on automobiles and Buddy Bearings on trailers but am dumb as dirt on hubs the size on my coach .

Herman

[garyreed]

Herman,

Same thing only bigger. I thought you already had oil bath hubs? That would indeed be the right time to check the brakes.

If you have grease pack bearings now you will need to pull the hubs anyway to clean out the grease so it will get new seals.

How many miles are on your coach since the last brake service? Does it have air brakes.

The shoes might be OK but you need to visibly inspect the shoes for glazing, cracks, deterioration of the friction material, and oil and grease contamination.

Also the drum should we worn evenly with no cracks or ridges.

Gary

[rsbilledwards]

One topic not mentioned here is how tight the nut should be after you remove it to do all that needs to be done. If the bearings are not being replaced. Then count the number of revolutions it takes to remove the nut and replace with the same and replace the cotter key. There is play allowed but not very darn much so play it safe and count particularly if not familiar with how tight is too tight. Some times getting the seal to slide over the hub shoulder can be a bugger, it takes patience and make sure you do not leave parts behind where they do not belong like the last guy that worked on the coach before I got it. He left part of the old seal, metal part, on the shoulder and then jammed the new seal over the top of that. It lasted quite a while until I was in there and then it started leaking like crazy..go ten miles , stop fill it up and repeat. It took a quart and a half to get home to find out what happened.

Bill

[jleamont]

I disassembled the front hubs, wiped all of the grease out, inspected the bearings and races, replaced the seals (which are the same for grease or oil) reassembled and filled with 80W90 synthetic gear lube. All of my brakes are air drum and were replaced last march.

I have seen people wipe the grease from the outer bearing and just replace the hub cap with the oil bath type and fill'em up with gear oil. Then just change it out every few months or not. You will mostly see this on Semi Trailers, then the grease/oil combination turns into a slurry, but holds up.

Herman, not much different from a trailer bearing design only larger.

[wolfe10]

One topic not mentioned here is how tight the nut should be after you remove it to do all that needs to be done. If the bearings are not being replaced. Then count the number of revolutions it takes to remove the nut and replace with the same and replace the cotter key.

Bill

I would caution that unless one has done a LOT of these, that a dial indicator be used to set end-play. Yes, some axle manufacturers have "work around" methods for achieving the proper tolerances. Tolerances are generally in the .001- .005" range.

And, with a big, heavy hub and generally tire as well, this is not an area where guess work is your friend. I would certainly not assume that there was zero wear on the OE bearings-- quite likely they have worn in and may be out of desired tolerances.

[garyreed]

Herman

Are you going to replace them yourself?

It can can be accomplished fairly easly and I do agree with Bill.

Every mechanic has their own ritual that works for them and the intrernet is full of facts and opinions, would stick with sites like Timkin or Stemco not the Youtube guru who dances around swinging a hammer and chisel. Just my thought

Gary

[hermanmullins]

No I will leave that task to a much younger and stronger expert.

Expert, Ex = a has been and a spert = is a drip under pressure.

Herman

[garyreed]

I was always told I was not one. Now with the definition, I am sure.

Gary

[wildebill308]

No I will leave that task to a much younger and stronger expert.

Expert, Ex = a has been and a spert = is a drip under pressure.

Herman

I thought this started about what oil to use in your oil bath hubs? So what are you doing replacing seals?

Bill

[manholt]

OK. Too all of you!

Now that I started this, in my mind as dumb and now feel dumber, I would like to know what the pro and con is in the change over?

Carl

[hermanmullins]

Bill,

I understand that the subject have gone all over the place. I did start by asking about what weight of oil to use in the Oil Bath Hubs. Others have asked and made comets about greased hubs or oil bath, would you change and why.

As far as changing the seals, I didn't mean that I was going to change them. However I do believe that if I am going to work on such as the hubs, more especially on such a large item as on a motor home, I would replace every thing replaceable while I have it torn down. Bearings, Seals, and Pads. Also turn the rotors.

See even I got off track again.

Thanks,

Herman

[wildebill308]

OK, I just wanted to make sure I didn't miss interpret what was going on.

Bill

[rsbilledwards]

There is always the tendency for the non-professional and capable individual to include all of the parts when making a minor maintenance like changing a seal "just because I am there". This is not always necessary or prudent. If you have a fat one in your left rear pocket that is ok and you can walk away fiscally unaffected. Bearings and races and the seals are pricey, NAPA wanted $92 a seal for the ones on my little coach. I ended up paying $48 wholesale. The bearing itself was near $100. It takes a lot to warp one of these rotors and a turned one will warp faster than unturned. If your rotor shows fractures in the middle of the rotor you are due. A better solution and one all will smile about many miles down the road is to replace the rotor with a CRYOGENICLY treated one. These will outlast untreated rotors 3 or 4 times. They dissipate heat much better and resist wear which is heat induced. These rotors , the short version, are frozen in nitrogen which changes them molecularly and allows them to be just so much better. I thing the smart way to approach this is replace only the fronts as this is where most stopping, heat and wear is generated. Rear rotor and drums do not wear as fast as the front as evidenced by the frequency of Pad replacement. To offer an example of this, our coaches do not wear as fast as our everyday or toad transportation since we have additional stopping aids like PAC brakes and JAKE brakes. CENTRIX ROTORS Made in the U.S.A. You must request this process when ordering and the best part it is very cost effective. I know off topic but part of the overall.

Bill

[manholt]

I'm still asking! Why would you go from packed bearing to oil bath bearing? Pro/con, please?! I'm in Cummins now and will be until Friday PM. On my list is to check brake and bearings! So far my estimated bill is $4,218. I like Bill's idea about rotors! But, hope mine are good till next year...lol

Carl

[jleamont]

Carl, maintenance is my reason. It is much easier to drain some oil out each year and top it off then pull the hub off, clean and repack the bearings, replace the seal and reassemble each front wheel end. Another reason I read was less rolling resistance which equals better fuel economy. I felt that was splitting hairs but non the less someone took the time to calculate that along with LED chassis lighting and how it reduces alternator load which equals better fuel economy. I can respect their test results but fuel economy was not my reason. lets just say getting old and lazy was the reason. Fuel economy was not the reason my coach is 98%LED I made that switch so I could be seen better in the dark.....less chance if getting hit.

[claudine]

I use Lucas hub oil in the front wheels. I had the original grease seals replaced and the mechanic that did the work used the

Lucas oil and recommended I continue to use Lucas oil. I have had good service with this oil and very rarely do I have to add

oil. Just another opinion.

[hermanmullins]

Thanks Claudine, and Welcome to the Forum.

Herman

[tetonchief]

Ok, so just for clarification....

I have a Ford F53 you check the oil removing the center rubber cap

You pop the cap, suck the oil out with a suction pump, refill slowly, let sit, suck it out again to get a better flush, then refill with all new oil (just to the top of the bottom lip on the hole where it would drip out), replace seal, go back and top off after it sits a while and then you are ready to go?

I am planning on using Royal Purple Synthetic gear oil....sound ok? And it should only take 1 quart of oil to do this procedure on both front wheels?

Thanks for the help!

[wolfe10]

Most oil/wet bearing caps have a circle with arrow and "full" mark. It will be below the fill hole, as fluid expands with heat.

[wildebill308]

Ok, so just for clarification....

I have a Ford F53 you check the oil removing the center rubber cap

You pop the cap, suck the oil out with a suction pump, refill slowly, let sit, suck it out again to get a better flush, then refill with all new oil (just to the top of the bottom lip on the hole where it would drip out), replace seal, go back and top off after it sits a while and then you are ready to go?

I am planning on using Royal Purple Synthetic gear oil....sound ok? And it should only take 1 quart of oil to do this procedure on both front wheels?

Thanks for the help!

Let us know how much it takes. I was looking at a cross sectional drawing and it might take more than some think. Royal Purple should be great.

Bill

[manholt]

This sounds so much easier and cheaper than messing with packed bearings! Now on my must do list for peace of mind!

Carl

[jleamont]

This sounds so much easier and cheaper than messing with packed bearings! Now on my must do list for peace of mind!

Carl

Yup, my thoughts exactly. That was the reason for my change over to oil.

[garyreed]

I agree, in my opinion, oil bath is the way to go.

The idea of sucking a small amount of oil out and replacing it with new is where I may think different. As Bill stated, looking at a cross section of a hub, most will have a reservoir in the center between the bearings that hold most of the oil. Some hold more and some less. You will only be able to get maybe an 1/8 to no more that a 1/4 of the total oil in the hub. To do this over and over seems like a lot of work and great potential of contaminating the oil in the hub.

My belief is check it and forget it. You should be able to visually see the level in the glass and don't stick your finger or anything else for that matter in as it could lead to more contaminants in the oil.

One more thought, depending on how or where you wash your coach, you may not want those oil caps and plugs accessible to a pressure washer since water could be forced into the cap. I have full chrome caps on mine for that reason and I wash the coach myself.

Gary.

[manholt]

Gary.

I use a pressure washer on my coach when I wash it once per year! Just stay further away from the work on sensitive areas or turn the pressure down!

Carl

[garyreed]

I absolutely agree Carl, those of us fortunate enough to be able to wash our coaches can keep an eye on the water.

For those who use commercial truck washes and the like need to keep an eye out.

Now talking about water I do have a short story that I laugh about now, not so funny then.

My daughter was helping me wash ours when she was 6 or 7. I was brushing and she was rinsing. We were at the back when I came around the corner and she was filling the exhaust pipe with water. I can't remember how long it took to bubble the water out and dry up.

Gary