SHOVELDOG Report post Posted July 30, 2016 Hi, Not new to RVs, we sold our last class C three years ago. We are not in a position to buy a new coach-- are looking at 10 - 12 year old decent quality class A units. Today we inspected & drove a 1994 Allegro Bus DP, at least a grade above the others we are looking at, but older. 94k miles and in the hands of its 2nd owner since 1998, who was meticulous in its maintenance. Very clean inside & out with fairly recent full paint & decals, the roof & fittings were in great shape. We looked in every cabinet, door, hatch & cover, and found nothing but neat, orderly & ship shape everywhere we looked. New tires & recent batteries, water heater, reams of records & all the books. Many upgrades & add on features inside & out to make life easier, and everything worked. Oshkosh chassis, 230hp turbo Cummins, Allison 6 speed. It rode & handled nicely, very few rattles & squeaks. It really did seem ready to hit the road for the West Coast tomorrow. The older couple (members of FMCA) who own it said they will be sorry to see it go (I believe them). Advancing age is making the maintenance tougher for them, the husband did much of it including some relatively heavy stuff himself. Looking for thoughts & opinions. Thanks in advance. Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hermanmullins Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Mike, Welcome to the Forum. I don't know where you may be located. However here is a website you might check out. They have nice clean coaches that you may interested in. www.motohomesoftexas.com Herman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHOVELDOG Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Thanks Herman, but we are back east. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hermanmullins Report post Posted July 31, 2016 10-4, I understand but take a look they have excellent views of each coach. It may give you a base line on pricing. Herman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Any Tiffin coach pre 06' was very good and solid. With everything you said, my only concern is the "Oshkosh" chassis (they where solid but heavy) and don't know if a 230 is big enough an engine to move it in todays environment. Back then the speed limit was 55 mph on the freeways, nation wide. Then there is the up/down hill issue. I'm guessing the coach is 40'? What price do they want? Over 50K forget it. My engine should be a 500+ ! Carl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHOVELDOG Report post Posted July 31, 2016 34' we had it rolling at 70 today, no sweat, hills would take a toll sure, but the owners went from mid west to the west coast a couple of times towing a car. Asking low 20s, on the high side for something that old, but condition is unbelievable. Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Well just by it and go camping. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Agree with you Bill. It either will or won't and my gut tells me, buy it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Shoveldog, sounds like a nice coach. I'm not familiar with the Oshkosh chassis but the older mechanical engines produced great power (despite their ratings) and were simple to keep on the road. do you have maintenance records to review? What roof does to have, rubber, metal or fiberglass? No signs of water leaks? Since you are now new to RV's you are probably familiar with all of the things that are common failure points, just be sure all of that is good and the power train had all of its required maintenance I.e coolant replaced etc. there is one of there for sale 3 miles from me, just without full paint. Out here on the east coast, especially in the North East we have slim pickings for used motorhomes and even worse for good RV dealers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Joe. Had you read the OP's post, he has all maintenance and add on records in coach... He's also not new to motorhomes, Just class A, DP's. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted July 31, 2016 Yea, I missed that part. Maintenance records...more specific detail would be needed. If it still has the coolant in it from 1994 it's not a deal. Some people feel an oil change is all that is needed. It sounds like a nice unit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHOVELDOG Report post Posted August 1, 2016 Joe, Coolant changed every three years, he specifically went over the 3 or 4 drain valves and the fill & bleed procedure with me. Had the engine covers off looking at the maintenance points there too. The man knows this thing inside & out. In most respects, it really is the perfect scenario everybody hopes to find when buying a used anything. No reservations about anything on this rig, but still, it nags me..... l wonder about the costs of keeping it on the road, paying for chassis maintenance. While I am handy and a middling shade tree mechanic, no diesel experience, and not a spring chicken. The coach end of it doesn't bother me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted August 1, 2016 Shoveldog, no Diesel experience wouldn't be hard to learn on a coach in that age group, basic mechanical skills is all you should need. Oil changes are no different than a car, just more oil and grease fittings to hunt down. Those engines were very simple and not much to go wrong if taken care of, which sounds like the case with this one. The most complex item would be the throttle system, otherwise you are not much more technical that an American engine with a carburetor, they might actually be more complex than that come to think of it. Well taken care of coaches can be hard to find, old mechanical Diesel engine would be my first preference. Also, if you decided to pay a truck shop to do the work, since its not a complex engine it will save you money there also. If it were me I would be headed for the bank today. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RodgerS Report post Posted August 1, 2016 "l wonder about the costs of keeping it on the road, paying for chassis maintenance." This is not something unresolvable. I'm sure he will tell you things like mileage, you can review the maintenance schedules and talk to a local mechanic to get an annual estimate. You can control that by doing some of the work yourself as you well know. ======= I consider it a general rule that an older, quality built, dp is a best buy if it has been well maintained. Your inspection risk tradeoffs are: 1) owner's representations 2) written documentation 3) yours and professional inspections Your three critical areas are water damage/leakage, chassis, and engine. Your personal inspection is only as good as your knowledge base. Owner's representations mean nothing as too many owners basically have a use it until it breaks operating mode. Based on what you have represented, you need to have all three done by professionals. Plus establish a baseline with fluid tests. With an older dp, I would consider fire risks to be partially minimized by replacing the refrigerator, now and continually looking for discolored spots on the observable electrical system, and installing a fire suppression system in the engine compartment. And an additional electrical focused road ready inspection. Twice annual water damage and electrical system problem inspections. Possibly an infrared water damage inspection. ============ One of the best benefits of buying an old unit is doing interior upgrades. One of the worst results is missing an obvious problem because the buyer either was clueless or simply refused to pay for complete and detailed inspections. There are too many forum threads where someone had to cough up $15,000 more or less because they failed to do the inspections. Rodger S. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RodgerS Report post Posted August 1, 2016 Add on: No, inspections won't catch everything. The word new with respect to tires means nothing. The DOT date is what is more important, then a visual inspection. You should weigh the coach to see what your loading capabilities are. I agree that more than $50,000 would be questionable, but it seems a dp holds some value just because it is a diesel. (I would be willing to pay an extra premium if I concluded the coach had been taken really good care of and came with great documentation of the maintenance - this is really more a perceived value with a coaches 10 + years old) You didn't say you have had a look under the coach to check for rust. Basically, it sounds like a great opportunity you should not pass by without a darn good reason generated by the inspections, but that said, many inspection identified problems can be dealt with...the problem is not identifying them. Rodger S. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted August 2, 2016 It doesn't matter what you buy you will have maintence cost. You could buy a newer one and have more problems. Like I said buy it and go camping. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted August 2, 2016 1 hour ago, WILDEBILL308 said: It doesn't matter what you buy you will have maintence cost. You could buy a newer one and have more problems. Like I said buy it and go camping. Bill Agreed, at least he has a solid foundation and power plant. Nothing wrong with old school technology. That's back when Diesels were dependable and simple. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted August 2, 2016 My last coach was a 91 cross country by sports coach, 34 ft dp, same engine, it is on a spartan chassis. Can say nothing but praises for that rig. It had Cummins 230 with Allison Ht740 "4 speed" transmission. Plenty power for that coach, was governed at 69 mph, 2100 rpm. 7 to 9 mpg depending on terrain, and on flat at 60 mph sometimes topped 10 mpg. She weighed 21,000 loaded, and I towed 3400 toad with those figures. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHOVELDOG Report post Posted August 3, 2016 We are pretty close to clinching a deal on the Allegro Bus. Thanks to all who contributed to the conversation Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SHOVELDOG Report post Posted August 7, 2016 On 8/3/2016 at 10:31 PM, Shoveldog said: We are pretty close to clinching a deal on the Allegro Bus. Thanks to all who contributed to the conversation Mike Well, on the day I was going to go the bank & arrange the funds, the owner called and said he had someone who wanted to look at the bus. He called as I asked him to around 10:30AM. Unfortunately I mis-cued and gave him the home phone (he doesn't email), instead of my cell. Needless to say, by the time I got home for lunch & the message, it was gone. Real bummer as we had both fallen for it. Spoiled for Tiffins, I looked at a very clean 34' 1996 Allegro bay 454 powered today & will look at a V-10 powered 2000 Allegro 32' wide body with a V-10 later this week. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RodgerS Report post Posted August 8, 2016 Just for consideration...this would be my approach to your next deal. Now that you have a list of suggestions and some experience: 1) there is always another deal around the next corner 2) always be ready to strike quickly on a used coach. Have an agreement with someone at the bank that when you hit the green light, they are ready to confirm that the funds are available for transfer, they can help with the title, and the paperwork. This assumes that like me, you have a list of a dozen or so sources for locating your coach. I would try to have at least two acceptable mfgs...in this case Tiffin and Newmar. I think remodeling and upgrades can cure a lot of issues. Be ready to talk for an hour and half on the phone. In that time you should be able to decide, based on the representations (assumptions), whether or not this will work, then negotiate the price and make the conditional deal. Have your paperwork ready so you can make your edits and shoot the signed paperwork to the owner and he can sign and shoot it back (if necessary). This includes an agreement that the coach is now off market. This is a done deal. I think if the coach and owner are good...you just need to get on the stick. Your paperwork should include the price and how paid, the owners representations, and a list of what you will do to confirm (conditional upon). You connect up the bankers that day or the next, but no funds get transferred until your confirmations are complete and the bankers are happy. I would try to get two to four weeks to make appoints and get fluid samples analyzed. You just have to negotiate it all. Note: I'm quite sure some people will tell me to take a hike, but if the owner is reasonable you should be able to negotiate out mutually acceptable conditions, including timing, the above being just starting thoughts. You should assume that a "clean" desirable coach will disappear fast as used buyers are generally much different in behavior and thoughts than new buyers. Rodger S Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted August 8, 2016 Mike. Sorry it did not work out for both of you! Best wishes on future... Carl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RodgerS Report post Posted August 8, 2016 I have no idea what your budget is, but if you can you should jump on this: http://motorhomesoftexas.com/coachrv/monaco/2006--cayman--36SBT--C1917 Do a search on the internet and on various forums "2006 Monaco Cayman." Unless you can find something problematic I would be on the phone tomorrow. Don't bother asking forum members what they think until you are inside the deal. If there were problems with that year and model it has been already discussed on the forrums and is researchable. 36 feet, $62,500 offering price, 22,780 miles, "very little evidence of use." Close a deal with inspection conditions, and get er done. The price will be the art of good judgment followed up with inspections to confirm. If I was ready, I would close the deal and have it taken off the market with 10 minutes of discussion, then drive out with my inspection tools and line up inspections at break time...assuming my research did not disclose a deal breaker. (Forget the gas stuff, remodel to make the floor plan work) Rodger S. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
huffypuff Report post Posted August 8, 2016 On 8/8/2016 at 10:04 PM, RodgerS said: I have no idea what your budget is, but if you can you should jump on this: http://motorhomesoftexas.com/coachrv/monaco/2006--cayman--36SBT--C1917 I would walk away from that as it has the problem 4 bagger trailing arms. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted August 8, 2016 I agree with Huff. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
