captainmitch Report post Posted September 13, 2018 Dealer Mileage Fraud question. We bought our used class A coach a month ago in Kentucky. It was advertised as being in "Great Cond" with mileage stated as 70,000. Picked it up, the (odometer read 70K), and headed west for the summer. Yesterday in Arizona I hit the trip counter to zero it and run a fuel consumption check and low and behold it scrolls thru to a mileage number of 120,000 !! 50k more than the dealer claimed and put on the bill of sale and extended service plan app. Now we have a unit with almost double the mileage we thought and fraudulent mileage shown not only on the vehicle registration title, but also on the service contract (I'm sure that the contract is now useless) . Anybody got any advise ?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfe10 Report post Posted September 13, 2018 captainmitch, Welcome to the FMCA Forum. I would start by gathering the facts: Pull a car-fax or equivalent. Ask to see a copy of the odometer statement (most states) signed by the previous owner. If engine hour meter, how many hours on it? Should easily be able to determine if 70k or 120k miles. Speak with the previous owner. At this point, not sure if this is a misrep by dealer or previous owner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captainmitch Report post Posted September 14, 2018 Thanx Wolfe, Will try the carfax, no eng hour meter but the genset hour meter is 260hrs. I believe the dealer got the unit at a Fl. auction so I doubt I will get a previous owner unless the carfax turns one up. I am looking for a lawyer in Ky. to get some legal standing before I open the door to what will probably be a not pleasant discussion with the dealer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted September 14, 2018 Welcome! The dealer probably knows less than you. That big a miss representation on a DMV milage form and Extended Warranty, would net him, a lot more trouble than you (Law against that)! So try to be pleasant when you break the news . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alflorida Report post Posted September 14, 2018 20 hours ago, captainmitch said: Dealer Mileage Fraud question. We bought our used class A coach a month ago in Kentucky. It was advertised as being in "Great Cond" with mileage stated as 70,000. Picked it up, the (odometer read 70K), and headed west for the summer. Yesterday in Arizona I hit the trip counter to zero it and run a fuel consumption check and low and behold it scrolls thru to a mileage number of 120,000 !! 50k more than the dealer claimed and put on the bill of sale and extended service plan app. Now we have a unit with almost double the mileage we thought and fraudulent mileage shown not only on the vehicle registration title, but also on the service contract (I'm sure that the contract is now useless) . Anybody got any advise ?? Curious. Are you saying the odometer was left in "trip" setting and had 70,000 miles. Then when you reset it and switched it to the true odometer reading it showed 120,000 miles? What year, make and model of MH do you have? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obedb Report post Posted September 14, 2018 Gotta be some liability there. You have the documents. Do not let the dealer have access to your coach until possible proof of fraud is verified. Who does not know how to scroll between actual mileage and trip mileage today? Something stinks, but you will have to pay a lawyer. Oh well! Good luck! 👍 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
richard5933 Report post Posted September 14, 2018 Would you have bought the coach even if you knew that the mileage was that high, assuming the price had been adjusted accordingly? If so, then my first approach would be to get the dealer to adjust the price. You might have a good chance of such as adjustment given the following. Of course, I'm not an attorney so you would be best to check this out with one before taking action. Kentucky does have rules regarding mileage disclosure: 190.300 Disclosure of mileage upon transfer of motor vehicle or motor home. (1) Any transferor must give a written disclosure to the transferee in connection with the transfer of ownership of a motor vehicle or motor home: (a) Disclosing the cumulative mileage registered on the odometer. (b) Disclosure that the actual mileage is unknown, if the odometer reading is known to the transferor to be different from the number of miles the vehicle has actually traveled. (2) It shall be a violation of this section for any transferor to knowingly give a false statement to a transferee in making any disclosure required by this section. Effective: January 1, 2015 History: Amended 2014 Ky. Acts ch. 27, sec. 24, effective January 1, 2015. -- Created 1976 Ky. Acts ch. 246, sec. 7, effective June 19, 1976. 190.310 Liability for violation of KRS 190.270 to 190.320 with intent to defraud. (1) Any person who, with intent to defraud, violates any requirement imposed under KRS 190.270 to 190.320 shall be liable to the transferee in an amount equal to the sum of: (a) Three (3) times the amount of actual damages sustained or fifteen hundred dollars ($1,500), whichever is the greater; and (b) In the case of any successful action to enforce the foregoing liability, the costs of the action together with reasonable attorney fees as determined by the court. (2) An action to enforce any liability created under subsection (1) of this section, may be brought in a Circuit Court of a county in which the purchaser of the motor vehicle resides. Effective: June 19, 1976 History: Created 1976 Ky. Acts ch. 246, sec. 8, effective June 19, 1976. Assuming that the dealer in Kentucky provided the required written disclosure, and assuming that it reflected the incorrect odometer reading, it would seem that a simple call to the appropriate state agency (Kentucky Motor Vehicle Commission) could create quite a problem for the dealer. Even more so if the phone call is preceded by a letter from an attorney notifying them of your intention to take action and of your desired outcome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted September 15, 2018 If you can prove that he knowingly made the wrong entry! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
richard5933 Report post Posted September 15, 2018 3 hours ago, manholt said: If you can prove that he knowingly made the wrong entry! All you really need to prove is that it will cost him more to do nothing than to negotiate a settlement. I'm sure that most of these situations never actually get to the point where proof of prior knowledge or intent is necessary. If this dealer has more than two customers he's not going to want this dragged through the news. Hopefully. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hermanmullins Report post Posted September 15, 2018 When we purchased our present coach, we were told up front that coach had approx. 16,000 more miles then shows on the speedometer. They had to change it out. I can pull up the mileage on my Trip Tec and it shows to be correct. Herman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rayin Report post Posted September 20, 2018 Doesn't an Allison transmission control module keep a permanent mileage log? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obedb Report post Posted September 20, 2018 When I lost an ECM on a Series 60 500HP engine, (western Star) everything on the dash went dead. The engine would still turn over, but that was it. Had it towed to the area Detroit Diesel/ Allison shop about 30 or so miles away. When the module was replaced all of the essentials were there. Mileage, engine power..... Etc. Flash Memory?? The same engine was used in Prevost conversions for a few years and I think Bluebirds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dkreuzen Report post Posted September 21, 2018 My engine ECM stores the mileage along with too-numerous-to-mention other information including fuel usage since it was new. Maybe a visit to a service facility for your engine and have them read the ECM data to see what is stored in it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obedb Report post Posted September 21, 2018 But does it act as mine did? All of the essentials must have been stored in flash memory, because the ECM was no longer usable but the important stuff was preserved. Would have to dig out old tax forms to be sure, but with the towing bill included , was well above $2500. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Afordeck Report post Posted October 5, 2018 Had an ECM replaced last summer, mileage went to 0. Serviceman entered correct mileage. I cannot believe a serviceman could not back up the displayed mileage just as easily Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
