CHASSIS CHOICE

[JOS66]

Good Day All
My name is James. Just found the forum and am really glad I did. 

Not a newbie to RVing, but it has been 25+ years since I did, so I am out of touch with what is good and not good.

Driving and handling is no issue due to growing up farming and racing with NHRA (vast travel). Drove Duallies with trailers to Diesel Class A with 30ft Stacker to Tractor/Trailers. BUT, I humbly ask you to review my questions and requests for wisdom, to help a bird that wants to fly again. AN OLD BIRD!! LOL

I am looking at buying a Newmar Dutch Star 4310. Am considering used and new. 

Questions:

1. Freightliner or Spartan Chassis? Why?
2. Is the Cummings L9 a good engine? 
3. Allison 3000? I know the 4000 is good, and have had several others before in delivery trucks and the smaller with several Duramaxes. But do not know the 3000. 
4. How well do the Slides hold up?
5. How well do the Storage Doors hold up?
6. Does the Dutch Star have any cooling issues? 
7. Any issues with Mechanical, Plumbing, Generator or Electric?
8. Areas that are prone to leak? (windows, area of roof, slide, etc) 

Please Note: I am asking about issues and things that are common or a weak spot with the Model. 

Thank You ALL in advance and Happy Easter to You and Family!!! GOD BLESS!!!

 

Edited April 3, 2021 by JOS66

[wildebill308]

Welcome to the forum. Where are you located and where have you been looking? Also what made you decide on the Dutch Star 4310? There are several models in the Newmar lineup  that a similar. New or used opens a lot of possibilities in that price range.

I have to run out but will get in more depth on your questions a little later.

Bill 

 

[JOS66]

19 minutes ago, wildebill308 said:

Welcome to the forum. Where are you located and where have you been looking? Also what made you decide on the Dutch Star 4310? There are several models in the Newmar lineup  that a similar. New or used opens a lot of possibilities in that price range.

I have to run out but will get in more depth on your questions a little later.

Bill 

 

Hey Bill

Thanks for the reply. 

Currently in eastern NC, but preparing to move to TX and just started looking nationwide. 

Dutch Star (DS) 4310? Was looking at Entergra, A/Coach and Newmar. The Boss and I really like the layout and the 2nd full bath and Bunk Options. We have 4 kids that will each meet up with us for long weekends. Having the 2 bath/Bunk options will be good for us and give us flexibility. 

 

 

Edited April 3, 2021 by JOS66

[charlieiam]

I own a 2008 Newmar albeit not a Dutch Star.  Other than a few minor things that I have corrected myself,  I had the awning motor replaced, a stuck caliper replaced, new set of tires and batteries.  The house and cabinetry are up to Amish standard quality and reputation; beautiful solid clear maple interior.

Used condition will depend upon the previous owners' care and maintenance.

New condition will depend upon the quality now being offered under the ownership of Winnebago.

A quality used Newmar has a reputation...the future is unknown.

[wildebill308]

3 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Currently in eastern NC, but preparing to move to TX and just started looking nationwide.

Where in Texas are you looking? I am in the DFW area.

 

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Freightliner or Spartan Chassis? Why?

I have had both and don't see any major differences. I have a Spartan now.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Is the Cummings L9 a good engine? 

Absolutely.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Allison 3000? I know the 4000 is good, and have had several others before in delivery trucks and the smaller with several Duramaxes. But do not know the 3000. 

The 3000 MH transmission is a solid and reliable. I had one in my last RV never had a problem.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

How well do the Slides hold up?

The better quality the coach the better the slides. Never had a problem.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

How well do the Storage Doors hold up?

Like any thing you might need to adjust one but rarely. When I got this coach one of the latches the screws were loose in the latch. It still latched but that was one latch after tightening  it up I haven't had a problem. I hear of few problems on the forums.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Does the Dutch Star have any cooling issues? 

Are you talking AC or engine? I haven't heard of any.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Any issues with Mechanical, Plumbing, Generator or Electric?

NO.

5 hours ago, JOS66 said:

Areas that are prone to leak? (windows, area of roof, slide, etc)

With any RV you need to do your annual inspection of all sesames and check all the sealant and re seal as needed. but no general problems.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Bill

 

[wildebill308]

35 minutes ago, charlieiam said:

New condition will depend upon the quality now being offered under the ownership of Winnebago.

A quality used Newmar has a reputation...the future is unknown.

I see the addition of Winnebago a definat quality improvement over what was.

Bill 

[JOS66]

29 minutes ago, wildebill308 said:

Where in Texas are you looking? I am in the DFW area.

 

I have had both and don't see any major differences. I have a Spartan now.

Absolutely.

The 3000 MH transmission is a solid and reliable. I had one in my last RV never had a problem.

The better quality the coach the better the slides. Never had a problem.

Like any thing you might need to adjust one but rarely. When I got this coach one of the latches the screws were loose in the latch. It still latched but that was one latch after tightening  it up I haven't had a problem. I hear of few problems on the forums.

Are you talking AC or engine? I haven't heard of any.

NO.

With any RV you need to do your annual inspection of all sesames and check all the sealant and re seal as needed. but no general problems.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Bill

 

Bill

Thanks for the feedback.

On the Cooling question, I am asking in relation to the engine. I have heard that if not designed right, Pushers can run hot due to lack of air flow in extreme conditions. The Pusher that I towed a Stacker with years ago, never had a problem. BUT, since it can be such a major problem, I wanted to ask the Soldiers on the ground. Salesmen will tell you anything to get a sale, LOL!!!!

Edited April 4, 2021 by JOS66

[rayin]

Freigthliner and Spartan build side-radiator MH chassis, which IMO is preferable to a rear-radiator chassis.

[wildebill308]

Is that model a side or rear radiator. Both work well if kept clean and driven properly.

Bill

[JOS66]

2 minutes ago, rayin said:

Freigthliner and Spartan build side-radiator MH chassis, which IMO is preferable to a rear-radiator chassis.

I agree!!! The Pusher we ran years back was a Side Radiator. 

[JOS66]

2 minutes ago, wildebill308 said:

Is that model a side or rear radiator. Both work well if kept clean and driven properly.

Bill

Side I believe

[urbanhermit]

Based on my one direct experience, I'd avoid Texas RV Supeerstore in Willow, TX, outside Dallas.  The salesman was cooperative and straight-forward, the closing agent was pleasant, efficient, and helpful, but the manager did his best to welch on his word about a make-good.  It took me months to wear him down.  

[wildebill308]

3 hours ago, urbanhermit said:

Based on my one direct experience, I'd avoid Texas RV Supeerstore in Willow, TX, outside Dallas.  The salesman was cooperative and straight-forward, the closing agent was pleasant, efficient, and helpful, but the manager did his best to welch on his word about a make-good.  It took me months to wear him down.  

So you didn't go to NIRVC?

Bill

[hermanmullins]

9 hours ago, urbanhermit said:

Based on my one direct experience, I'd avoid Texas RV Supeerstore in Willow, TX, outside Dallas.  

Willow, Texas is more than outside of Dallas, it is close to 240 miles south.

Herman

[elkhartjim]

Herman, He probably meant Willow Park which is between Fort Worth and Weatherford.

The biggest difference I see in Spartan and FTL is the difference in the number of dealers. It seems to me there are many more FTL dealers and I understand most FTL dealers work on Spartan. It would most likely only be an issue for warranty work. 

All of the newer Dutch Stars are side radiator which is a huge maintenance benefit but you do loose the outside storage bay.

 

[kaypsmith]

One issue that  like in Spartan over FTL, is Spartan normally has a shorter turn radius than most others. The Spartan chassis is noted to be the most preferred in this country for fire engines, and consequently are designed for shorter turns. Just my opinion, yes I have owned both in the past.

[huffypuff]

You can take a Spartan back to the factory for service and they do a great job for both warranty and paid jobs.  I just done so for mine.  The same goes for Entegra as they will go out of their way to make it right.  

[manholt]

JOS66.

Very few brands, I have not had in the past 54 years of class A ownership.  That also goes for chassis!  Unless you get a pre 2007 DP, you have your choice of 3 chassis, Freightliner, Spartan and Powerglide, the later is by Tiffen and only available on a Allegro DP.  I currently run a Spartan K3 Mountainmaster and Allison 4000, Cummins IISX600.  My previous coach was a American Coach Tradition 45Y, Spartan K2, Allison 3000, Cummins 425.   

The only reason for Allison 3000 or 4000 is limited by HP and Torque, Less than 500 HP = the 3000.  Have never had any issues with a Allison!  

Regardless of make/model, the only problem is EPA mandates.....Newer coach, you get EGR, Particulate filter and DEF, also a lot of Electrical run by computers!  The old days of KISS is long gone...

Rear radiator or side?  They both have +/- !

Feel free to ask us anything any time!

[andyshane]

I've had both Spartan and Freightiner, an engineering buddy and fellow airline pilot on his third DP passionately argued in favor of Freightliner.

In retrospect, the chassis work we've had done proves his point: Freightiner dealerships are like 7-Elevens, dotting the landscape. I have yet to spend a cent and still have two years of warranty remaining. When our Def head went out -- a problem common to both Spartan and Freightliner -- I was stranded 18 miles from Empire, the flagship of Freightliner service centers, and they sprang for the wrecker. When I caught sight of a balding tag tire, the factory was only two hours away; they gave me a free hookup and aligned all axles in addition to giving me a new tire.

This weekend, I was parked next to another 2019 DSDP at a San Antonio resort. He was Spartan. We'd bought our rigs the same month. We'd suffered a similar number of woes, with our chassis. But, his experience was completely different from mine: shops were hard to locate with long wait times, he'd just had a freshly-detailed bus returned to him muddy and filthy from a local shop that shrugged off his protests. A buddy with an Essex on Spartan had the ultimate experience, though. Simple ball joint replacement. At Freightliner, the parts would be on-hand, the job would've taken a morning. His bus was at a truck shop for five weeks, waiting for parts from overseas.

It should be noted that of the myriad Freightliner shops, many are "Oasis" locations, meaning you can overnight on-site. No truck shop that is registered as a Spartan dealer can make that claim, to my knowledge.

[huffypuff]

3 hours ago, andyshane said:

I've had both Spartan and Freightiner, an engineering buddy and fellow airline pilot on his third DP passionately argued in favor of Freightliner.

In retrospect, the chassis work we've had done proves his point: Freightiner dealerships are like 7-Elevens, dotting the landscape. I have yet to spend a cent and still have two years of warranty remaining. When our Def head went out -- a problem common to both Spartan and Freightliner -- I was stranded 18 miles from Empire, the flagship of Freightliner service centers, and they sprang for the wrecker. When I caught sight of a balding tag tire, the factory was only two hours away; they gave me a free hookup and aligned all axles in addition to giving me a new tire.

This weekend, I was parked next to another 2019 DSDP at a San Antonio resort. He was Spartan. We'd bought our rigs the same month. We'd suffered a similar number of woes, with our chassis. But, his experience was completely different from mine: shops were hard to locate with long wait times, he'd just had a freshly-detailed bus returned to him muddy and filthy from a local shop that shrugged off his protests. A buddy with an Essex on Spartan had the ultimate experience, though. Simple ball joint replacement. At Freightliner, the parts would be on-hand, the job would've taken a morning. His bus was at a truck shop for five weeks, waiting for parts from overseas.

It should be noted that of the myriad Freightliner shops, many are "Oasis" locations, meaning you can overnight on-site. No truck shop that is registered as a Spartan dealer can make that claim, to my knowledge.

FL shops are authorized to do Spartan work as per CS at Spartan.   I has a local FL shop do yearly maintenance as well recalls, TSB.  They did TSB, Recalls and warranty work for free.  They also have separate park for rv's and can stay in it if needed.  Last MH I had a Roadmaster chassis and they service that also.  The one before that was a Oshkosh chassis and the service that also.  Bottom line is they are truck/bus chassis and service by most truck shops if they are willing to work on RV's.   That includes Cummins repair shops.   

[manholt]

True!

 

[JOS66]

Good Day All

Thanks much for the insight and testimonies. I am leaning towards the FTL. 

 

[jleamont]

After being in the trucking industry (service dept) and having a career working on Fire Apparatus, my only option would be Spartan. Freighliner has wiring and poor engineering problems on all of their products. In my experience Freighliner under engineers and Spartan over engineers. 

[huffypuff]

Many high end motor coaches use Spartan chassis.  Entegra, Newmar, NeXus RV, Foretravel and now Jayco started using them. If you want a motorcoach with comfortdrive, steerable tag and the best riding air suspension go with Spartan.  

Edited April 11, 2021 by huffypuff
dang autocorrect

[JOS66]

Well noted. 

Funny, the very ones I am looking at (that the Boss) and I like, all have Spartan. 

One of the primary boxes to tick for me is Service and Support. As stated we are leaning towards a Dutch Star 4310, so unless I have misunderstood, Newmar rates very well in this area. I know there are other good manufacturers as well, but we really like the floor plan.