rcoon2 Report post Posted July 17, 2018 Greetings. My name Is Rick. I have removed the original dometic refrigerator from my 1995 Beaver Marquie and will be installing a Haier french door unit. As this unit only uses AC i will need to add a 1500 watt inverter to keep things cool while driving and boondocking. I currently have a Heart 20D inverter / charger that is working fine. I have 6 interstate deep cycle 6V batteries. I have two questions. 1. I am wondering if i can piggyback a second inverter off the connection on the back of the heart inverter to avoid having to run new battery cables all the way to the batteries. 2. The new / second inverter has a built in automatic transfer switch. My idea is to connect the output of a 15 amp breaker in the coach load center (from the original refrigerator outlet) to the input of the new inverter. Then run the output of the inverter to the original refrigerator outlet. I realize i could probably just replace the existing inverter with a larger unit but they are much more expensive that a smaller unit and i would like to avoid the expense if possible. Thanks for your advice in advance, Rick Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
desertdeals69 Report post Posted July 17, 2018 One note 40 minutes ago, rcoon2 said: Greetings. My name Is Rick. I have removed the original dometic refrigerator from my 1995 Beaver Marquie and will be installing a Haier french door unit. As this unit only uses AC i will need to add a 1500 watt inverter to keep things cool while driving and boondocking. I currently have a Heart 20D inverter / charger that is working fine. I have 6 interstate deep cycle 6V batteries. I have two questions. 1. I am wondering if i can piggyback a second inverter off the connection on the back of the heart inverter to avoid having to run new battery cables all the way to the batteries. 2. The new / second inverter has a built in automatic transfer switch. My idea is to connect the output of a 15 amp breaker in the coach load center (from the original refrigerator outlet) to the input of the new inverter. Then run the output of the inverter to the original refrigerator outlet. I realize i could probably just replace the existing inverter with a larger unit but they are much more expensive that a smaller unit and i would like to avoid the expense if possible. Thanks for your advice in advance, Rick One note of caution. I installed a Haier refrigerator and the compressor failed in 4 months. I was told there is no warranty because it was installed in a motorhome. I would get a written statement from them stating it is ok in a motorhome. I now have a Insignia from Best Buy. I called Insignia factory a was told it is ok to install in a motorhome and they also told me of the 3 year warranty extension for $100. I bought the warranty so now it is good for 5 years. I use a 3000 watt Xantrex with 6 AGMs. 800 watt solar with a MPPT 40 amp charge controller. I am currently at the FMCA Gillette and if anyone wants to see my install call me 702-497-9946. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted July 17, 2018 DD69. Your fixing to get very wet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f433921 Report post Posted July 17, 2018 When I installed the residential refrigerator I powered with the existing modified sine way inverter. My original inverter is a 2000 watt. I wouldn't install a second inverter unless you current one is undersize or doesn't have the proper waveform for you new refrigeration. It that the case I would upgrade you inverter to meet your needs. Jim Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted July 17, 2018 Rick, There are some items that need to be answered. Your inverter and battery setup is big enough to power the unit, but does it use solid state control boards? Will the motor run on a modifier sine wave . Solid state circuits can have less then favorable operation on this type inverter and the RMS peak voltage average is below that of a pure sine wave inverter. 2. The new / second inverter has a built in automatic transfer switch. My idea is to connect the output of a 15 amp breaker in the coach load center (from the original refrigerator outlet) to the input of the new inverter. Then run the output of the inverter to the original refrigerator outlet. Powering a second inverter from a MS unit could create some interesting harmonics in the line powering the refrigerator. The Basic design is not setup for the scenario you are contemplating. Could generate some unwanted heat in both the inverter and the fridge. If you have the needed test equipment and can construct a test setup to test your idea - with the ability to return the items. It would be interesting to know the result. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted July 17, 2018 DD69, you operated the same type refrigerator on an older inverter, that was most likely a modified sine wave and you have now up dated to a 3000 watt unit. Is the new one a pure sine wave inverter? 3000 Watt inverters where not vary common in your year coach. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted July 17, 2018 Carl, Keep your fingers crossed, tomorrow is party time. Hopping for none of mother natures light shows. Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
desertdeals69 Report post Posted July 17, 2018 26 minutes ago, DickandLois said: DD69, you operated the same type refrigerator on an older inverter, that was most likely a modified sine wave and you have now up dated to a 3000 watt unit. Is the new one a pure sine wave inverter? 3000 Watt inverters where no vary common in your year coach. Rich. The old inverter was a SW2000 watt Xantrex, pure sine wave. I haven't used a msw in 20 plus years. I also changed coaches 2 1/2 years ago. I have installed 3k inverters for years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dickandlois Report post Posted July 17, 2018 39 minutes ago, desertdeals69 said: The old inverter was a SW2000 watt Xantrex, pure sine wave. I haven't used a msw in 20 plus years. I also changed coaches 2 1/2 years ago. I have installed 3k inverters for years. That is interesting ! Kind of skews the failure to the refrigerator. One would consider a 2000 W sine wave source large enough to power the refrigerator. Thanks for your feedback ! Rich. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bm02tj Report post Posted July 17, 2018 All things run better with a pure sine inverter but some will run on modified sine I would use nothing but a pure sine in my motor home Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rcoon2 Report post Posted July 18, 2018 Hello Rich and thanks for your response. I am not sure what what MS is...modified sine wave? My heart 20D is as far as I know a pure sine wave inverter. At any rate not sure where the harmonics would come from. I am only pig tailing off the DC input to the original inverter to avoid having to run a longer DC cable to the battery from the new inverter. My idea is to purchase an Aims 2000 watt pure sine wave inverter. the new heart/xantrex inverters are insanely expensive. Although i am sure they are better quality than the Aims i am looking at I can't justify the difference...at least not until the aims stops working and my ice cream melts If i am not understanding your concerns please let me know. Thanks to all for your input. Have a nice day. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jleamont Report post Posted July 18, 2018 rcoon2, we run the refrigerator below on the 4, 6v batteries and the original MSW inverter, 2000 watt with no issues. I discovered this model in a New 2013 Fleetwood Excursion, I called GE and was told no issues in a motorhome and due to it not having any delicate electronics the MSW inverter was fine. https://www.google.com/shopping/product/2316434820952652378?lsf=seller:8740,store:3205702000217060434&prds=oid:7350340753543665112&q=ge+15.5-cu+ft+top-freezer+refrigerator+(black)&hl=en&ei=459PW9LOGY-c_QbKhJGgBg&lsft=gclid:EAIaIQobChMI9eHVy7up3AIVDUsNCh2-JQ9YEAQYASABEgIi5fD_BwE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rcoon2 Report post Posted July 18, 2018 Hi jleamont thanks for your response. I have already purchased the haier refrigerator. My only concern with using the existing inverter is its already wired into the coach electrical system. It runs two dedicated circuits and only has two AC outputs neither of which go anywhere near the refrigerator alcove. not really interested in piggy backing off the existing inverter output either for fear of overloading those circuits. which brings me to adding another inverter. Thanks for your input though! Rick Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted July 18, 2018 Rick, did your old refrigerator have an ice maker? Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elkhartjim Report post Posted July 18, 2018 Why can't you connect to the outlet the ice maker used? It should be on the inverter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
manholt Report post Posted July 19, 2018 And you call me "brilliant"..nothing wrong with your light bulbs! I hear we have a fire around Horseshoe Bay! 700 ac.+ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elkhartjim Report post Posted July 19, 2018 PM'ed you about fires. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rsbilledwards Report post Posted July 19, 2018 Rick This issue could be easily solved by the Beaver club or for that matter safarifriends@yahoogroups.com as it is most likely on a Magnum chassis with a similar electrical system as the Safaris of the same era. I see no reason the unit cannot be run on the same electrical system as the original. The 20d is a modified sine wave and yes the reference MS is modified sine. The only time a refer uses any power is during the start and only momentarily. You will learn how to adjust your power usage with time, we have all been there, it is called a learning curve. It is not difficult to run power anywhere in your coach just takes a bit of time to find the path of least resistance. Last year we modified my electrical system so the entire coach will run off the inverter a 2000 watt Magnum pure sine wave. Once I got the cut off voltage right it has worked perfectly. Now not every thing can be on at the same time and it took a bit to learn what will run together. Numerous trips were made to the basement to hit the reset buttons on the inverter. Did you fine the solution to the testing the temp sensor question? Bill 1999 Safari Panther . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted July 19, 2018 On 7/17/2018 at 2:05 PM, rcoon2 said: 1. I am wondering if i can piggyback a second inverter off the connection on the back of the heart inverter to avoid having to run new battery cables all the way to the batteries. What is the wire size from batteries to the inverter now? My biggest concern for this scenario is that the wire size is too small to run both simultaneously, and is there a fuse or breaker between the inverter and the batteries in the event there is an overload. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rsbilledwards Report post Posted July 19, 2018 Kay, likely not as not is the Safaris and not in Beavers of the time frame I have seen. Cable from batts to inverter typically 00 or 000 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rcoon2 Report post Posted July 19, 2018 Hello all. Let me see, yes the old refrigerator had an ice maker, however it plugged into the same (non inverter supplied) 110 volt outlet as the refrigerator. Don't belong to the Beaver Club any longer... My beaver is actually on a Gillig chassis...awesome! Yes i did get my cooling issues resolved only to be replaced by new issues a year later. The control box for the hydraulic cooling fan seems to stick on low from time to time. Not sure if its the valve inside the box or the solenoid that controls the valve. For now i just unplugged the control and it defaults to high speed...that works for now until i get a chance to tear it apart. But i have digressed, back to the refrigerator. I didn't realize the 20D was a MS unit. That make me want a second pure sine wave inverter even more! The refrigerator i purchased, model HRF15N3AGS, uses about 330-360 watts of power (3 amps) just sitting there and about 3 times that amount to start the compressor this is per the manufacture rep. which is why i am looking at a 1500 or 2000 watt inverter. I have asked Haier if it will run on a modified sine wave inverter... waiting on the answer. Hi Kaypsmith, that is a good question and a valid concern of mine as well. The current battery cables are 2/0 gauge and are protected by a 250 amp fuse. Probable just best to run new wires from the batteries to the new inverter based on the distance and current requirements with a separate fuse and battery shut off switch. Thanks for your input. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rcoon2 Report post Posted July 19, 2018 I guess another area of concern is regarding batteries. I currently have 6 each Interstate Batteries GC2-XHD-UTL 6v Golf Car Battery, Capacity: 232Ah (20HR) each. Does anyone have input regarding the batteries and will they have enough capacity to run 2 inverters. Probably depends primarily on what i use while unplugged from shore power! Your thoughts and opinions are appreciated. Thanks Rick Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaypsmith Report post Posted July 19, 2018 My suggestion would be to pull the 2000 watt and replace with a 3000, even if it means using a cheaper brand than Xantrex or Magnum. I have ordered several through ebay and have lasted 5 years now and still going strong. 2-0 wire will need to be replaced for this also in the event the 3000 is maxed at some point in time. I believe that a 2500 watt will be sufficient at this time with only the addition of the fridge, this way only move to one 4-0 wire and the appropriate breaker for the new inverter. What size fridge? There are several 12 volt dc/120 ac units available, only need to run 12v wire to the fridge, most of these units are very low wattage to run, they use a compressor, and come in many sizes up to 16 cf. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildebill308 Report post Posted July 21, 2018 On 7/19/2018 at 11:52 AM, rcoon2 said: Hello all. Let me see, yes the old refrigerator had an ice maker, however it plugged into the same (non inverter supplied) 110 volt outlet as the refrigerator. Well maybe. One side is 110 only and the side the icemaker plugs into is powered by the inverter. Otherwise you couldn't make ice cubes when on gas and no shore power. Test it with all 110 off, shore power /generator check both outlets with a meter (make shure your inverter is on). Let me know what you find. Bill Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
desertdeals69 Report post Posted July 21, 2018 On 7/18/2018 at 4:01 PM, rcoon2 said: Hi jleamont thanks for your response. I have already purchased the haier refrigerator. My only concern with using the existing inverter is its already wired into the coach electrical system. It runs two dedicated circuits and only has two AC outputs neither of which go anywhere near the refrigerator alcove. not really interested in piggy backing off the existing inverter output either for fear of overloading those circuits. which brings me to adding another inverter. Thanks for your input though! Rick I would check with Haier to see if they will warranty it if it fails like mine did. Not worth the effort to install it if its not going to last. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
