Dip stick shows no oil

[HeatherRourke]

Hi Guys.I purchased a 34’ 1999 Allegro bay with a Ford v10 engine in it.  My LO changed the oil and filter when we got it and as needed after without any issues... until now.  

Prepping for my work trip from NH to Colorado he changed the oil and filter while I prepped everything else.  Went to get going and heard a sputtering swishing sound..  looking around found the oil was spraying out from the oil filter. In the end turned out the gasket stayed on when he took the other filter off and he didn’t notice, so when he put the new filter on there was no people seal between the two gaskets.  

Fixed that, added another quart of oil because that’s about what was lost before realizing the extra gasket was the cause.  

Drove out to Colorado with no problem, purrs like a kitten still, no signs of any leaks or spotting under the motorhome when stopping, no smoke. Once I settled in here for work I went to check the oil, and the dipstick had oil on it when I pulled it out.  I wiped it with a rag and finagled it back in and pulled it out again.  No oil on the stick, didnthis several times and show nothing.  I know sometimes the oil is difficult to see but front and back nothing.  I wipe it with a cloth and nothing on the cloth.  

I called LO. He said maybe we had lost more oil than he thought and suggested I add another quart. I added another quart.  Waited still nothing showed..  just the tip Had oil still. He suggested another quart, did that and the same thing.  I started the motorhome up and  turned it off like when I get my cars oil changed and the dip stick was full of oil (like when I first took it out).  Whipped it and tried it again (several more times) and still shows no oil...   

I called my LO again and he says..”you know, now that I think of it whenever I’ve checked it it’s always showed empty” when he has done the oil change we always recycle the oil and it’s not low when we refill the bottles.

I’m thinking there is plenty of oil, but not showing on the dipstick. And my concern is that I added too much oil and might damage it.  Is there any way to confirm the oil level?  There’s no signs of leaks the engine sounds and feels perfect, no smoke.  Nothing to indicate anything is wrong.  

The only thing I can think is to buy tools and oil pan  and drain the oil and  re-fill it by the quart so I know exactly how much is there.  But other than a few bucks on proper stuff,  I’m no sure where I can do this.  I’m far from home, and do not think I am supposed to do that in a parking lot. 

Really don’t want to spend the money at a shop. They charge so much for an oil change on a motorhome when it takes minutes to do one.  AnD I literally just had it done a few days ago. 

Any one have experience with dipstick not showing an oil level? 

Any suggestions on how to check the actual level of oil?

Any suggestions on where to do an oil change yourself when your far from home?  Can you do it at an auto parts store? 

 

 

[jleamont]

If you saw oil on the stock after shutdown it’s safe to say there is oil in the pan. I and also assuming you had oil pressure on the gauge?

It sounds to me it’s just that low on oil or the stick is t fully seated. I personally would verify the stick is fully seated and if so add another 1/2 quart and check the dip stick. If there is oil present keep adding until close to full.

Don’t start the engine during all of this. It will just confuse the situation with the oil splashing around and really only proves there is some oil in the oil pan. 

There is no way to check it without draining the pan and measuring it out. 

[richard5933]

Any way to tell if that is the proper dipstick for the engine?

[elkhartjim]

I'm sorry, but what is LO? I first thought she was referring to Low Oil. The LO stated it never showed on the dipstick before, possibly the correct amount of oil has never been added after oil changes.

[mailman]

Well, lets get down to basic's .

What kind of motor oil are you using?  The only oil to use in the Ford  V-10 is 5 W 20.

The oil returns in the engine are small, which is the reason for 5 W 20. Hope

there is no restriction in the engine. Check to make sure you check what kind of

oil filter to use. I have a Ford V -10 in my motor home. The dip stick is really in a bad

spot first to find it than making sure it is seated. Without measuring it, I believe

a yard long. I Use the Ford 5 W 20 oil, stays very clean even with 5000 miles on it.

I change mine between 3000 - 5000 miles.

I think WE need get the basic out of the way, why is the oil not returning to the pan, 

use of weight   of oil. The V-10 Ford requires  oil changes on a schedule.

Tim the Mailman   

N8AHK

[HeatherRourke]

LO.  Sorry for any confusion.  LO = Loved One.  

As for the gauge, it is as it normally is.  Just shy of the middle. 

 

I am not positive how to tell if it is the correct or original dip Stick.  There was a file of documents of work that had been done, but nothing mentioned about anything with oil.  Only “engine” area work was something about the heat and ac being fixed.  I didn’t recognize the name of the parts, but was described on the receipt slip. 

 

As for the oil type, yes.  We are using the 5w -20. And changing it every 3-4K miles.  I’m not positive about the oil filter used. I bring the old one into the auto part store, tell them what I drive and they give me a new onNe. 

 

I think the dip dip stick is all the way in. The cap goes into the top fully. I just have to twist and bend it to get i all the way in, but I assume because it’s so long. 

 

I am not positive what a restriction in the engine means.  

I am parked where I am for the next week. But should I add more oil and see if it shows on the dipstick? I’m afraid there’s already too much oil in there. 

[wildebill308]

3 hours ago, HeatherRourke said:

I called my LO again and he says..”you know, now that I think of it whenever I’ve checked it it’s always showed empty” when he has done the oil change we always recycle the oil and it’s not low when we refill the bottles.

What or who is a LO? This is pretty sad that someone working on it sees there is no oil on the dipstick after a oil change and doesn't do or say anything to correct the problem.

The V-10 holds 6 quarts with a new filter, maybe a smidge more depending on the filter. 

If you have put 6 quarts in and it isn't showing on the dipstick you probably have the wrong dipstick. In reality the only way to know is to drain the oil and measure how much you have. Puting 5 qt back in the engine(the filter will have some oil in it already) and see if it is showing on the dipstick. Then if it is a little bit low you can top it up. You will lose a little to the process but not much. If it doesn't show on the dipstick that would indicate it was the wrong dipstick. You could get a used dipstick from a salvage yard and see if it shows the right oil level. You can always calibrate it using this method.  

Bill

[HeatherRourke]

Yes. LO is a Loved One.. He definitely should have mentioned it before to me when he noticed it..  One of the many reasons I dislike others doing things for me. I figured this was a simple enough task to let someone else do.  I rather know and be educated and understand what’s going on so I can do, fix, or at least understand or expect certain things. 

I would only put 5 quarts back in, not the 6? The filter holds that much? 

Why do people change dipsticks? I’ve always had the same one for the life of my vehicles. 

Is this something that I could do at a Walmart parking lot? Or a auto parts store parking lot without getting in trouble? All o which are about 2miles from where I am parked. 

i can’t imagine that I went through the 6 quarts and 2 more I added getting from NH to CO without any indication that something is wrong to have it not sow on the dipstick.  Which is why I think there is now too much oil in there. 

[elkhartjim]

Thanks for the LO explanation.

I suggest you go to the local Ford dealer and explain your situation. They should be able to tell you if you have the correct dipstick and I can't imagine they would charge you much to change the oil and then you would know.

If you choose to change it yourself, maybe an auto supply place will allow you but please do not change it in a Walmart parking lot or any other parking lot without getting permission.

[jleamont]

8 hours ago, HeatherRourke said:

I am not positive how to tell if it is the correct or original dip Stick.

Can you photo the handle and the lower portion of the stick and attach them? 

 

7 hours ago, HeatherRourke said:

i can’t imagine that I went through the 6 quarts and 2 more

When there is nothing on the stick it doesn't mean there is no oil in the engine, it just means there is not enough to register on the stick. 

How many quarts were put in the engine when the oil was changed? 

 

7 hours ago, HeatherRourke said:

Why do people change dipsticks?

On a large diesel engine there were many instances where the coach builder altered the dip stick on the engine and the readings were never verified. On a F53 its highly unlikely, or shall I say all of the coaches I worked on (more than I can count over a 20 year period) over the years it they were always straight from Ford as the F53 came with the dip stick in the perfect location. 

[HeatherRourke]

3 hours ago, jleamont said:

Can you photo the handle and the lower portion of the stick and attach them? 

 

When there is nothing on the stick it doesn't mean there is no oil in the engine, it just means there is not enough to register on the stick. 

How many quarts were put in the engine when the oil was changed? 

 

On a large diesel engine there were many instances where the coach builder altered the dip stick on the engine and the readings were never verified. On a F53 its highly unlikely, or shall I say all of the coaches I worked on (more than I can count over a 20 year period) over the years it they were always straight from Ford as the F53 came with the dip stick in the perfect location. 

When checking takin pics of the dip stick, I noticed there is a thin line of oil along the back side of one edge.  Is that just where it slides along the inside of the tube? Or is that the actual oil level mark? Other than what is along the edge it is dry except for the tip still.  

 

There were 6 quarts added with the oil change itself.  

[wildebill308]

11 hours ago, HeatherRourke said:

I would only put 5 quarts back in, not the 6? The filter holds that much? 

Yes, you have already filled the filter, 6 qt would overfill the oil level. 

I also find that someone has changed the dipstick but can't come up with another explanation, as you say it never shower oil on the dipstick.

Maybe Joe can see if that is the right part number on the dipstick.

Bill

[elkhartjim]

Is it possible the oil pan could have been changed at so point to a larger oil pan?

[jleamont]

That is the correct dip stick for an F53. 

1 hour ago, HeatherRourke said:

Is that just where it slides along the inside of the tube? Or is that the actual oil level mark?

Are you certain that the oil isn't so clean you just cannot see it? You could be seeing where its touching the tube. It might be best to let it sit overnight and pull the stick in the morning, that will give you the easiest reading and use the reading on the first pull. Make sure to rotate the stick over and see if the side without the writing reads, sometimes it can make it easier to actually see the level. 

Your engine is a 6 quart system with the filter per Ford; Super Premium SAE 5W-30 Motor Oil XO-5W30-QSP

Later years went to 5W20 weight oil and 7 quarts.

 

[kaypsmith]

Here is a paste that can be used on the dipstick to see if any hydrocarbons show up on the stick, as mentioned above the oil may be so clear that it doesn't appear visible. I doubt that it will work if you use synthetic, but should work fine on any petroleum based oil.

KK003 --> Kolor Kut® Gauge Pole Indicator Paste, Fuel Paste

You could use piece of wire that is stiff enough to push down the dipstick tube, don't try to over push, just till it stops, then pull back out to see if any oil is on the stick. I have seen a time when a dipstick tube had come loose and was no longer in the oil pan and that could be a reason  for the dipstick not showing correctly. It would require someone crawling under to verify if this could possibly be the case. Over the years I have found many possibilities for explaining the unexplained.

[five]

Get a long piece of some type of stiff but thin material (the small diameter tubing used for drawing trans fluid out would be perfect), and push it all the way in, as far as it will go......pull it out and see what's on the end of the tubing.

[HeatherRourke]

2 hours ago, Elkhartjim said:

Is it possible the oil pan could have been changed at so point to a larger oil pan?

I have no idea.  I purchased it used, but it came with a file of work that has been don’t on it. I went through all the documents nothing is regarding the oil pan anywhere.  Doesn’t necessarily mean it was not done.  I just have nothing confirming it was.

[HeatherRourke]

2 hours ago, jleamont said:

That is the correct dip stick for an F53. 

Are you certain that the oil isn't so clean you just cannot see it? You could be seeing where its touching the tube. It might be best to let it sit overnight and pull the stick in the morning, that will give you the easiest reading and use the reading on the first pull. Make sure to rotate the stick over and see if the side without the writing reads, sometimes it can make it easier to actually see the level. 

Your engine is a 6 quart system with the filter per Ford; Super Premium SAE 5W-30 Motor Oil XO-5W30-QSP

Later years went to 5W20 weight oil and 7 quarts.

 

I will try it again tomorrow. I know sometimes it’s difficult to see and you need to turn it in the correct angle to see the glisten, but after I cleans it from the initial pull because I had been driving it and turn it on the cloth is clean. I will try again in the morning now that I have it parked and take a look the first one I pull it out.

 

i thought this was something supposed to take 6 quarts of the 5-20.  That is what I have been using since we got it.  😖That is what the auto parts store said to use when we first went to do it and gave them the info, then my LO  said that is what he uses on his as well. 

 

Have i done damage using the 20 instead of the 30? 

 

[jleamont]

5 minutes ago, HeatherRourke said:

Have i done damage using the 20 instead of the 30?

I doubt there has been any damage created by this so soon. If it were being operated in a cold climate I would let it be, if operated in a warm/hot climate I would correct it.

I had the same year V10 in our old coach. I ran full synthetic 5W30 and a Motorcraft oil filter (you can get them at Walmart). 

[rayin]

Does the dipstick feel slick when checking oil level? Don't use a rag in your hand when checking, bare skin will detect oil on the stick if present.

FWIW, internal oil passages are unrelated to oil viscosity, all auto engine mfgrs use lighter weight oils to help meet EPA fuel economy standards. For the last several  years, many auto mfgrs now recommend 0W20 synthetic oil to help meet fuel mileage goals.

[elkhartjim]

1 hour ago, RayIN said:

FWIW, internal oil passages are unrelated to oil viscosity, all auto engine mfgrs use lighter weight oils to help meet EPA fuel economy standards. For the last several  years, many auto mfgrs now recommend 0W20 synthetic oil to help meet fuel mileage goals.

I challenge you on that comment, RayIN.

The 2015 Jeep Wrangler I had required for 0W-20 or 5W-20. The quick lube place made a mistake I used 5W-30.  I didn't get a block before the oil light came on. Turned around, they drained and used the correct weight oil and the light went off. 

Sorry OP, I don't want to hijack the post but I wanted to correct a statement or at least how it related to my Jeep.

[HeatherRourke]

I pulled the dip stick again this morning without whipping it first the initial look is like the picture.  A small streak of oil along the edge.but the from back and other side are dry.  The small street on the side goes about 2” above the full oil mark..  which if that is the actual oil reading would make since since I added the two quarts? 

Sorry for the clarity of the pic,  with the sun it was hard to get proper focus on it.  But that’s how it looked when I pulled it this morning. 

[hermanmullins]

My suggestion, if you are able to do it yourself, would be to get a drain pan and drain the oil. This way you can see how much oil is actually in the crankcase. It would only take the cost of the oil and then you would be able to know for sure if 1) your oil was at the proper level and the dipstick was wrong or 2) you were actually low on oil. If #1 then you can see about getting the proper dipstick or if #2 you will know you were low and can monitor the engine to see if it is using or leaking.

One way or the other good luck.

Herman  

[jleamont]

I second Herman’s recommendation, this way you will know for sure and you can get the correct oil back into the engine. 

[rls7201]

Your "T" handle dipstick was on the recall list. It will show from 1/2 to 1 quart low when the proper amount of oil is in the engine.
The Ford replacement dipstick has a round loop handle to help eliminate confusion between the two dipsticks.
Easy fix, stop by your local Ford dealer and purchase the correct dipstick.

Richard