The Future of FMCA

[wolfe10]

Guys,

PLEASE, let's get back to the original topic.  This thread is not about Chuck or RVtravel.com.

The topic IS : "The Future of FMCA".

Let's not get side tracked.

Your constructive suggestions welcome!

[wildebill308]

Thank you Chuck for clearing that up. 

On 4/23/2020 at 8:52 PM, wolfe10 said:

The topic IS : "The Future of FMCA".

Let's not get side tracked.

Your constructive suggestions welcome!

I agree with you Brett. However the management is just blowing us off again. I have not gotten a straight answer to any of the things I or others have suggested or commented on. Why is that? 

[wolfe10]

Again, the members of the Executive Board are the policy makers for FMCA. The Executive Board is made up of  a national President, national Senior VP, Area VP's, national Treasurer and national Secretary. And, the major decision for the organization are decided by the Governing Board.

Staff merely implements policies established by the Executive Board/Governing Board. That even applies to the senior staff position-- the CEO. To expect that he can change policy is not reasonable. In this case "not my job" clearly applies (even if he has ideas on what HE would change).

If you have positive recommendations, e-mail THEM-- the members of the Executive Board-- they work for YOU. https://governance.fmca.com/officers.html

 

Please do not read this as my agreement with all FMCA policies, but we need to keep clear what staff can and can not affect.

[richard5933]

I would also suggest that this is probably not the most effective forum for anyone in leadership to engage in conversation about such things. While it's helpful for them to monitor pages like this, I've seen few conversations like this do anything other than become gripe sessions once leadership start participating.

If there are more than 70K members, obviously we in this thread are a tiny speck of the overall. Hopefully there is a better way to measure the needs/desires of membership than this.

[bm02tj]

I was going to wait till I retired to become a paid up member  but I felt it was time and I hope all other lurkers sign up and add to the pot to help them weather this down turn 

Bruce 

[wildebill308]

8 hours ago, wolfe10 said:

Please do not read this as my agreement with all FMCA policies, but we need to keep clear what staff can and can not affect.

Again, I am pretty shure it is the job and responsibility and duty of "STAFF" to report things that might help their organization especially when we are in a decline and losing revenue and members. Especially when they are in the CEO position. 

Bill

[manholt]

Bill, in some instances, CEO is merely a title and no bite...in most company's it's a title with real teeth!  

Brett is 100% correct.  Remember I was one of Governance until 12/31/2020, 7 years worth and can tell you...nothing moves until our vote is cast and that's at National Convention once per year!  

[rossboyer]

My son bought a travel trailer today. I was very proud to call FMCA and give him a membership with our number and an ‘S’ for Son. This is the future of FMCA. 

[wildebill308]

11 hours ago, rossboyer said:

My son bought a travel trailer today. I was very proud to call FMCA and give him a membership with our number and an ‘S’ for Son. This is the future of FMCA. 

That is exciting news. I bet you still haven't quit smiling.

Bill

[wildebill308]

12 hours ago, manholt said:

Brett is 100% correct.  Remember I was one of Governance until 12/31/2020, 7 years worth and can tell you...nothing moves until our vote is cast and that's at National Convention once per year!

 

23 hours ago, wolfe10 said:

Staff merely implements policies established by the Executive Board/Governing Board. That even applies to the senior staff position-- the CEO. To expect that he can change policy is not reasonable. In this case "not my job" clearly applies (even if he has ideas on what HE would change).

Once  Again, I am pretty shure it is the job and responsibility and duty of "STAFF" to report things that might help their organization especially when we are in a decline and losing revenue and members. Especially when they are in the CEO position. 

So we are suppose to wait for the  National Convention once per year! At that time The Executive Board/Governing Board will be allowed to run around and scream that we are losing membership and don't have a clue what to do.  Right now that may be anouther year. Is that the way we want to operate this organization? Don't you think it would be better to have some ideas to present to the board before hand? If it is important enough they could do like outher organizations and have a "Virtual meeting and implement changes before the decline goes to far. 

So Once  Again, I am pretty shure it is the job and responsibility and duty of "STAFF" to report things that might help their organization especially when we are in a decline and losing revenue and members. Especially when they are in the CEO position. 

Bill

[rossboyer]

If you have ever sat in on an Executive Board meeting, you would know that the Staff makes a lot of recommendations. But keep in mind that the National Area Vice Presidents are controlling the Executive Board. A year ago they took 5.5 hours changing the proposed budget to benefit their own travel, area travel, and area support under the disguise that the funds were needed for chapter visitation which on the whole they are not doing. 

[manholt]

Yep, we're back to that again.  The first year as ND, I got my travel allowance, the next year it was gone!  I can understand where Area VP's are coming from, some area's are huge, like North West.  

Bill, we have committees that are suppose to make recommendations to the EB each time they meet during the year, most of those make it to Governance for vote each year!  There are also recommendations that has to be voted on by General Members, before it gets to Governance!

I recommend that anyone who want's to know how your FMCA works, go to main page, scroll to bottom and click on Governance, then click on Constitution and also Policy and Procedure...read it. 

[docj]

2 hours ago, manholt said:

Yep, we're back to that again.  The first year as ND, I got my travel allowance, the next year it was gone!  I can understand where Area VP's are coming from, some area's are huge, like North West. 

One of the reasons I dropped out of the Beaver Ambassador Club (an FCMA affiliate) was that I thought the practice of providing officers travel allowances was obscene.  At the time I quit somewhere between 25-50% of dues revenue was being spent on such allowances.  I guess it's a good gig if you can get it.  Get yourself elected as an officer, then do a "woe is me" that the costs of going to all those rallies is a lot of money, so get everyone else to chip in to help pay you for what you signed up for as an officer.  For those of us who have no interest in rallies in the first place it appears to be a scam. JMO

[fagnaml]

All articles are that author's point of view. I disagree with his statements about membership fees being a cause for a decline in membership.   For me, the $75 annual FMCA membership is a great value given the benefits provided.   The Hankook Tire Discount program and FMCA pricing for Progressive insurance reduced my costs for those items in recent months by many, many times the cost of the membership.   When magazine subscriptions cost $25 (+/-) per year for the publications the wife and I receive (Men's Health, Men's Fitness, Southern Living, Louisiana Cookin, Magnolia, etc.) my "cost" of the FMCA membership really just $50 per year (i.e. I'd pay $25 per year for the FMCA magazine).   That $50 is only $15'ish a year more than a Good Sam Club membership that does not have the benefits we FMCA members enjoy.   The comradery enjoyed among FMCA members either on the forum or in person is truly "priceless" and well worth and annual membership fee.

My view is all RV owners love to show-off and talk about their RVs, offer help and seek help.  I for one need to do a better job of encouraging RV owners I know to do join FMCA to have a great resource and avenue to share / learn about joy of owning an RV.

I am very blessed with an outstanding, well compensated career so for me personally, a $75 per year membership fee is far from a burden on my personal finances.   I'd argue anyone owning a motorhome also has reasonably good finances as the cost to purchase and maintain an motorhome is quite steep.  Hence I don't understand why the FMCA membership cost would be a big reason for losing members.  Am I wrong?

 

[hermanmullins]

docj,

I never thought that as a volunteer, it would cost me between 10 & 12 thousand dollars a year to have the privilege to serve. I do it because I enjoy doing it. That being said I am an Officer in the South Central Area, Senior Vice President. I do not get paid for going to our area rally or planning meeting. However there are  three officers that do get paid mileage when they go to visit Rallies other than their own. Our Southern Region and Northern Region VPs go to visit chapter in their region. The purpose of those visits are to help chapter that may be going down in size and can use help. I myself travel in both area for the same reason when a chapter need help and one of the other VPs is unable to attend for some reason or to make a presentation to a Chapter celebrating an anniversary. Those visits are made by either our National Area Vice President or myself.

So yes some folks may be reimbursed for there travel. Do some abuse it, yes. But the majority of them spend much more than they are reimbursed.

So I say to folks, if there is something that you feel is not right or may need corrected don't just sit in front of a computer and complain. Talk to your National Director, Your National Area Vice President or even the President, or better still get elected to be a National Director, an area officer, in other words get involved. 

I deal with all of the above and must say they are all hard working men and women working together for one cause, FMCA.

Just My Humble Opinion. 

Herman

[fmcastaff]

22 hours ago, WILDEBILL308 said:

 

Once  Again, I am pretty shure it is the job and responsibility and duty of "STAFF" to report things that might help their organization especially when we are in a decline and losing revenue and members. Especially when they are in the CEO position. 

So we are suppose to wait for the  National Convention once per year! At that time The Executive Board/Governing Board will be allowed to run around and scream that we are losing membership and don't have a clue what to do.  Right now that may be anouther year. Is that the way we want to operate this organization? Don't you think it would be better to have some ideas to present to the board before hand? If it is important enough they could do like outher organizations and have a "Virtual meeting and implement changes before the decline goes to far. 

So Once  Again, I am pretty shure it is the job and responsibility and duty of "STAFF" to report things that might help their organization especially when we are in a decline and losing revenue and members. Especially when they are in the CEO position. 

Bill

Bill- I have engaged you multiple times in this thread and answered all questions(I think). What more would you like me to do? Almost everything you have suggested or recommended we are already doing. Your assumption above that the EB is doing nothing to try and solve the issues we are facing is flat out wrong. 

 

[wildebill308]

Well yes you have engaged multiple times. You have been, at best superficial in you answers and refused to answer or acknowledge direct questions in response. It might be beneficial to you to get a nice Big Chief tablet and go back and reread the suggestions proposed by me and others. Here are a couple things as a bonus. It was brought up you need to work to attract full time RV owners. Why? There are over 1.3 Million full timers out there. Re read what I said about Youtube. The average age of RV ownership is 48. Tell me how many registered RVs are out there?

"Almost everything you have suggested or recommended we are already doing".

Well no, no you are not doing it at least well enough to be seen by us out here traveling and doing business and interacting with dealers.

"  Your assumption above that the EB is doing nothing to try and solve the issues we are facing is flat out wrong."

Is it? You were asked about that and chose not to respond. My point is if "nothing happens till the EB votes" yet it could be next year before they meet.  So heare is your chance to explain what they are doing.

Bill

[manholt]

Docj. I have no idea of where your getting your figures from!  That's totally false information and if you still feel that it's true, BACK IT UP! 25%-50% of our dues, does not go to the care and feeding of our EB or Committee personnel.  

Herman, right you are!

WBill.  I'm sorry, but your idea of what Smithy can or can not do, is way wrong!  Stop beating the wrong horse, unless you want this post shut down!

[docj]

13 hours ago, manholt said:

Docj. I have no idea of where your getting your figures from!  That's totally false information and if you still feel that it's true, BACK IT UP! 25%-50% of our dues, does not go to the care and feeding of our EB or Committee personnel. 

I said that this was the percentage of dues revenue that the Beaver Ambassador Club was spending on mileage allowances.  I never said that it was true of FMCA itself. I was taking my information directly off of the published annual budgets.   And BAC justified its payments because the parent organization, FMCA, paid them also.

And for those who say that being an officer is a huge expense,  my response is that it is ridiculous that an organization would define a role for a "volunteer" officer that requires this much effort and expense.  Essentially,  you've created a construct where mileage allowances seem necessary but nothing says your construct is mandatory.

[manholt]

That's the way Herman and I understood your comment.  The same for "BAC justified it's payments because the parent organization, FMCA, paid them also."  The parent of BAC was Beaver!  BAC is a chapter of FMCA...Big difference!  Each chapter has a National Director (Governance member), we used to be reimbursed our expenses to get to FMCA National Convention.  We still had to pay for Parking & we had to be there, the day before, the opening of the Convention!  What a Chapter does with their dues, is not FMCA's concern, or business!

[manholt]

Now, let's all get back to the OP!  How do we off set annual loss, by positive gain and move on into the future!

At $75 per year today, is probably cheaper than my dues in 1967!  I don't remember what my cost was, but it included a metal goose egg, Constitution, By Laws and purpose of FMCA, a magazine, 1968 Annual Convention info. and contact info on Chapters & FMCA officers with phone #!  Since I was Oil Field Trash and moved around a lot, Chapters was out.  The 67' WB was a good investment $8,300 cash!  No more sleeping in my car or no tell, motel or sharing an Apt with 9 other people in NOLA.  My wife was a lot easier to get along with!!!  She took the coach and met other FMCA members, when I was working in LA. 10 days on a barge with 5 off. It did not take long for us to realize that wherever I worked, we had a Family!  We sold the WB for $11,000 in 1970, I was transferred to the Echofisk Oil Platform in the North Sea, Stavanger, Norway!  Wife became ex!

Perhaps we need to go back to basic and not concern our self, with all the discounts, we offer!  Family Motor Coach is who we where, now we are not.   Did we gain new and younger members to offset the avg age of 72.5 years?  No we did not...the avg age of a coach buyer today is 48!  They are not coming to us or GS, why?  

AIM is growing...each Rally is $650, 4-5 days of having a Blast, with food, music, sightseeing, exclusives, like minded people, all included.  IMHO, I think their on to something!

 

[docj]

2 hours ago, manholt said:

AIM is growing...each Rally is $650, 4-5 days of having a Blast, with food, music, sightseeing, exclusives, like minded people, all included. 

I agree that these sorts of events might attract some people who currently aren't interested in "more traditional" RV rallies.  Of course, an organization structured around such events still might not be of interest to those RVers who don't see rallies, of any sort, as being an integral part of RVing.   I have no idea what percentage of RVers fall into this category,  but we exist.  We're not antisocial but we don't necessarily assume that we have common interests with other people just because we both happen to own RVs.  Our MH is a way for us to be able to travel all over North America but it has little or no influence on our personal interests, hobbies, religious or political views, etc.  JMO

[manholt]

If I was going to guess, I would say 50+% fall into that group!   Are you full time?

[richard5933]

10 hours ago, manholt said:

Did we gain new and younger members to offset the avg age of 72.5 years?  No we did not...the avg age of a coach buyer today is 48!  They are not coming to us or GS, why?  

That's the question I've been asking for a while - why don't we ask the people we want as members why they are not considering joining?

It's not difficult to obtain buyer information for every RV registered with DMV offices across the country. I believe that having this information would permit us to do a survey and ask potential members why they are still potential instead of members?

Just a suggestion, but one which I think would be worthwhile.

[rossboyer]

Just so all are aware, it is very expensive to obtain the DMV information from all the states and provinces. Selectively, that has been done in the past, but the return on the investment wasn’t very good. I don’t remember the percentages.