5th Wheel For Full-timing

[MLnDavo]

We have just about settled on a coach, but my wife keeps coming back to the possibility of a 5th wheel for fulltiming. How many full-timers are in 5th wheels? Thoughts? Pros and cons specifically associated with full-timing?

[lmsooter]

Dave,

You may get some comments here from those who moved up to a coach from 5th wheels.

I have no experience with them although we did look at them as an option. We had 2 problems:

1. I have a problem even backing a boat trailer. But no problem with the coach.

2. The large vehicle required to pull the trailer will be your means of travel when you are parked. My Jeep gets better mileage than a large diesel truck.

[desertdeals69]

If you plan to spend weeks or months at a time in the same place it might work ok but if you want to move more frequently its a pain to get it ready to travel. You have to go from the trailer to the truck in all kinds of weather. I have traveled with trailer people and it takes an average of 2 plus hours before they can move. I can be on the road in 15 minutes in my diesel pusher.

[MLnDavo]

I think I've got her back on the right path...was just looking for experience to bolster my argument

[kaypsmith]

We never used a trailer, but we decided on the coach because my wife loves the ability to move about in the mh, also the ability to prepare meals as we travel, most trips she has the crockpot in the sink making delicious meals

for stops at a rest area, or when we arrive.

[wolfe10]

Also boils down to what vehicle you want to drive around when you are in a location for a long time.

Rarely is a HD one ton dually the "ideal" around town vehicle.

[jleamont]

We camp with friends that have a trailer. here are my observations:

1. When you arrive you have to exit to set up, in bad weather that can be a pain.
2. Set up and tear down usually takes at minimum an hour, us 10-15 minutes tops. And watching them is painful, I usually jump in to help, or cook their food, by the time I am done cooking they are just wrapping up.
3. When you arrive, the trailer is at ambient temps inside, cold or hot can be uncomfortable for some, while waiting for the systems to get the unit to your desired temp.
4. While in travel, you are at the mercy of using rest stops or gas stations for the rest room.
5. While in travel, stopping for a meal often cannot be cooked in the trailer without opening the slides, then most do not have generators if you need power, again you will be at ambient temps inside while this is all happening, chances are you will be done before the temps are comfortable. Our friends have to eat out on the road since its such a pain to use not set up.
6. The bucking and bouncing down the highway getting blown around gets old quick with a trailer.
7. One safety concern; when a trailer is set up you have no brakes to keep it secure in its spot, (unless it has air brakes) I watched one roll at a campground last year as it pushed the chocks along and the scissor locks between the wheels fell off.
   

I am sure here are downsides to motorhomes for some, if there is any they don't bother us. We often travel with friends with Trailers, these are the struggles I witness, and I have my first drink down, they are still setting up.

[RodgerS]

Some thoughts:

1) if you ask the question in a forum where most people have a mh, that may be something to think about.

2) if you ask the question in a forum where most people have a 5th, that may be something to think about.

3) this question is discussed in a lot of forums, so you may wish to expand your research to reading some of those discussions as well.

4) few repliers will give you enough context, in my opinion, but as you read a lot of these discussions, some of the context begins to seep through.

5) I am solidly planted on the fence. What probably will shift me over is a) I really like having a broad range of towable vehicles to choose from like a small car, a jeep, or a light 4/4 truck and 2) my wife can get motion sickness, so the smoothest rides help a bit, but even better if she is driving sometimes helps her avoid getting sick...she hates taking the medications.

6) We are going to the RVSEF conference in May and Susan is signed up for 3 hours of driving a Class A.

7) I'm the cook and I like the 5th kitchens and I like the more homelike feeling of a 5th. So, you see, it is not a perfect decision but one with multiple compromises for me. I really don't want to keep moving every one or two days, and since I will keep my house, it is harder to justify a used dp, but they are the best buys out there imao.

My personal adds mostly based on my readings, not actual experience:

a) Tear up and down time has been reduced quite a bit by 5th that has automatic leveling and automatic reset of pin height.

If you keep moving, yes, you could get worn down backing in to spots every day. If you don't move as much that is less of the backing up and the tear down and setups.

I don't like the idea of my wife walking around the MH when I'm driving, and If I have to use the toilet and I'm driving, I would have to stop anyway. I'm 15 years older than my wife so most of the stops are for me and mostly I'm driving.

As for the rain, I like the rain, but not always, so its a toss, and how much rain will I be setting up in...unknown.

c) I drove a 1 ton Silverado dually and liked it and I think it would mostly be ok as a daily driver. for me..but I'm speculating. I'm 66 and in very good shape from years of playing tennis and working out in the gym.

d) a lot of the 5th hauling tiredness issues appear to be substantially and well-addressed by some of the high quality pin boxes and hitches...at least that is what I'm told in the 5th forums. For example like a Mor-ryde pin box and Trail Aire hitch.

e) should be easier to have a chevy truck repaired or maintained, than a dp. (big truck draw for me!)

f) you can add a generator to a 5th, but generally it will be of the type that runs off propane.

g) I don't like most MH floorpans, but some I can live with, and I can remodel to fit my needs.

Being on top of the technology has value. Newmar dp comfort drive and aqua-hot water delivery have value.

Hard to put one hands on build and product quality in this industry, but great if you have up-skilled yourself as I have. Less stressful about some of these concerns.

[wildebill308]

I am late to this thread. So I will relate actual experience. I drive a Coach and tow a car. The coach gets 8.5mpg the car 30mpg.

I have only had a couple bad weather experiences, one was at a rest stop. I didn't have to go out side in the rain. The other was arriving at a campground during a heavy rain. I had a pull through and after I parked I started the generator, had supper and watched some tv until it quit raining. Then went out and finished hooking up.

I have ridden in a couple of trucks pulling fifth wheels. Being a front engine they had more engine noise. There is absolutely no comparison to the ride in my diesel pusher.

I have helped set up fifth wheel trailers before please see the comments above about what is involved.

I will just reinforce the bit about getting around in your prime mover. I have been in to many places where you just can't find a parking spot for a big truck. I have been several places where it was hard to find a place to park the CR-V. Some places where the streets are so narrow it is impossible to get around in a big truck. I do know about driving a big truck, My extended cab Silverado is nearly the same size as most heavy movers.

In my area most that started with fifth wheel trailers already had a heavy duty truck. There are more people looking to move up to a motor home gas or diesel than looking to move back to a fifth wheel.

Bill

[RodgerS]

Just a note, not being argumentative: the new Chevy diesel hd dually truck was very, very quiet during the demo...that is one of the things they are known for.

On the freeway it was smooth.

Unfortunately, very hard to get a ride in a new truck hauling a quality 18000 lb 5th with a quality pin box and quality hitch. Hope to learn more in Kentucky at RVSEF.

When I mentioned context, that means little information about the configurations whether MH or 5th. Just picking at in bits and pieces.

Recently I read that there are differences in ride between 4 bags, 8 bags and tag 10 bags mh. The best ride I have had so far in a mh were in two CC Allures 8 bagers, as an inspector.

My take is similar to the last poster, the trend is toward a MH with a towable. Safe to hedge your bets that way, but then all this is very personal. There is also a trend from 40 ft plus mh to class B's for part-time travelers with a home.

Note: I have read where people went back to a 5th after owing a mh.

All personal, all usage it seems. but the full-timer consideration is your key issue it seems to me and how often you will be on the road.

It is not surprising that this becomes emotion because it is so personal. And, I'm not a trend.

[casuall454]

Bedroom, to bathroom, to brewing morning coffee to driving first leg in my PJ's priceless.

Watching that same process from anyone pulling a trailer, just further reminds me why I really enjoy the benefits of motor coaching.

[wayne77590]

I had a 2007 Montana RL 5th wheel (39' 8") and I pulled it with a 2005 F350 King Ranch, Crew Cab, Long Bed, Dually. Probably the biggest over the counter 1 ton's one can buy. I had to make a few pivot turns in parking lots when shopping but the end results was, if a car can fit in it the dually could fit in it. There is always the next spot over. I found the 5th wheel easy to back up, but like the MH I always use a ground guide (DW).

If I was in a level site side to side, then hook up and tear down was no different than the MH with the exception of backing the truck to the MH and connecting for departure. I even had that down to a "science." Today, I would purchase a 5th wheel with the newer automatic leveling system. Dumping and flushing tanks takes no longer on a 5th wheel then it does on a MH. Pulling over in a safe spot to empty the bladder takes just about 30 seconds more in the 5th wheel as you have to get out and walk back to the 5th wheel. Weather be darned. DW prefers the MH because she can just walk back in the MH, as for me, well, I can last 2 to 3 times longer than her. Besides, as we grow older we should stop every 2 hours and stretch to prevent Thrombosis - it can happen - and to shake the cobwebs out.

The 5'er has more living space in a 40' length than a MH. From the front seats to the windshield is just gadget space in a MH. Yes, the seats can turn around for seating but there is still that unused void.

We travel only 3-5 continuous months out of the year and the rest of the time take short trips of a week or so around the state, so for us a MH seems to be working out. Insurance is higher on the MH than on a 1 ton and 5'er. Maintenance is higher on the MH. I believe the day to day, rolling earthquake going down the highway, has a higher toll on the MH than a 1 ton and a 5'er. If we were going to stay put for a month at a time or longer I would prefer the 5th wheel, but moving like we do the MH is a better option.

Really comes down to what one is comfortable with and meets their desires. IMHO

[RodgerS]

Great balanced post MSgt.

Here is another option - a super Class C, like a Jayco Seneca. Diesel engine up front, easy to work on, air bags in the rear and air seats in front, car air bags to protect passengers. Reported to ride as well as 4 bag DPs, but just what I have heard. Lots of towing capability and reasonably quiet.

==========

Was driving back from a round trip to Sonoma yesterday, tied up traffic, small lanes, some rain...lots of frustration and stress...was thinking about the various Class options and what I would prefer after getting parked at the end of the trip. Probably prefer my home and a long hot shower. Traitorous thoughts.

===

Well back to cooking school soon so need to study and practice my imaginary Chef skills like how to cut an onion correctly. Need to keep my promise to wife to cook up a series of French dishes before we go there.

[jleamont]

I had a 2007 Montana RL 5th wheel (39' 8") and I pulled it with a 2005 F350 King Ranch, Crew Cab, Long Bed, Dually. Probably the biggest over the counter 1 ton's one can buy. I had to make a few pivot turns in parking lots when shopping but the end results was, if a car can fit in it the dually could fit in it. There is always the next spot over. I found the 5th wheel easy to back up, but like the MH I always use a ground guide (DW).

If I was in a level site side to side, then hook up and tear down was no different than the MH with the exception of backing the truck to the MH and connecting for departure. I even had that down to a "science." Today, I would purchase a 5th wheel with the newer automatic leveling system. Dumping and flushing tanks takes no longer on a 5th wheel then it does on a MH. Pulling over in a safe spot to empty the bladder takes just about 30 seconds more in the 5th wheel as you have to get out and walk back to the 5th wheel. Weather be darned. DW prefers the MH because she can just walk back in the MH, as for me, well, I can last 2 to 3 times longer than her. Besides, as we grow older we should stop every 2 hours and stretch to prevent Thrombosis - it can happen - and to shake the cobwebs out.

The 5'er has more living space in a 40' length than a MH. From the front seats to the windshield is just gadget space in a MH. Yes, the seats can turn around for seating but there is still that unused void.

We travel only 3-5 continuous months out of the year and the rest of the time take short trips of a week or so around the state, so for us a MH seems to be working out. Insurance is higher on the MH than on a 1 ton and 5'er. Maintenance is higher on the MH. I believe the day to day, rolling earthquake going down the highway, has a higher toll on the MH than a 1 ton and a 5'er. If we were going to stay put for a month at a time or longer I would prefer the 5th wheel, but moving like we do the MH is a better option.

Really comes down to what one is comfortable with and meets their desires. IMHO

Wayne, I was thinking to opposite of you. "I believe the day to day, rolling earthquake going down the highway, has a higher toll on the MH".

We often camp with some friends with trailers, they often find broken stuff and items thrown throughout the interior from bouncing with a trailer that only has springs, no shocks. So one bounce turns into several. More entertaining to follow them down the road, we often joke upon arrival how their trailers spend as much air time as ground time, if only their credit cards would give them some of those air miles . I always tell them don't text and drive, when I follow you guys it looks like you are drunk, I'm reaching for the radio, lights and siren, lol. The response is always "I never touched my phone, you didn't feel that wind"? One of them is a professional trucker with over a million miles of no accidents.

Our old class C really beat the daylights out of the interior and body traveling down the road, as much as their trailers do, it just weighted more and we were in it to experience the shock, they only see the aftermath. I actually broke the coach body mounting once and cracked a wall. I guess its all on the suspension design of the coach/Trailer and the wonderful roads in the US we all can relate to.

[obedb]

Wayne/ had a fiver setup next to us last fall. Computerized with six levelers . Chatted with him while he set up. Pretty impressive.Don't think the discussion on what RV style is best will ever be settled. Traveling with pets is easier with a MH (especially cats), but probably a minor issue to most.

[manholt]

In ref. to a Super "C", that is a lot of wasted living space. Like a tractor with a small box trailer!

[RodgerS]

Once you settle on your class, even if others don't like that class,

but who cares what others think?,

it is pretty amazing how after 10 years the price becomes quite attractive

if you are comfortable with the challenge of buying used from a private party, have the cash,

and the diy skills. But it is not as convenient as buying new on credit from a dealership,

and even more convenient to able to look to others to fix everything on warranty,

if not always the quickest way to get back on or stay on the road.

RodgerS

[partsrod]

I am on my third MH with a 5th wheel in between over the last 25 years. Although the 5th wheel had more space on the inside there is nothing better than have the wife be able to use the rest room at 65 mph down the rode. Also the view from the drivers seat is a lot better from the MH being up higher.

[wildebill308]

Well I have decided on my "class" and no, no I don't care what others think but I am willing to try to help the uneducated.

I would think that someone who was "a trained inspector" could find a great deal on the used market. Even those who have "plenty of cash" should look at financing rather than tying up their cash in a depreciating asset.

It is amazing to me all the 5th wheel aficionados whining about the "lost space" in the front of a class "A" Yet not concerned that they have nearly 75% less basement storage. By the way I could store things on the front shelf when not moving.

"I believe the day to day, rolling earthquake going down the highway, has a higher toll on the MH". WHAT!

Wayne, I have had some gas coaches that rode hard but not nearly that hard if your 2008 Winnebago Destination is riding that hard you need new airbags. I have watched people tow trailers by me that the whole trailer bounced over the expansion strips.

Now here is something I really really need help with-- how is it better for a long term stay to have a trailer and a big truck to drive than having a diesel pusher with much more storage and a car that gets 30 mpg and easy to drive and park. Please explain how the trailer and truck combo is better.

Bill

[MLnDavo]

Thanks all...wife is officially off 5th wheels...so that's a win for me. We are also leaning away from the Super Cs, and are thinking of the Georgetown...I'm sure that will change a few more times before our target date.

[jleamont]

Well I have decided on my "class" and no, no I don't care what others think but I am willing to try to help the uneducated.

I would think that someone who was "a trained inspector" could find a great deal on the used market. Even those who have "plenty of cash" should look at financing rather than tying up their cash in a depreciating asset.

It is amazing to me all the 5th wheel aficionados wining about the "lost space" in the front of a class "A" Yet not concerned that they have nearly 75% less basement storage. By the way I could store things on the front shelf when not moving.

"I believe the day to day, rolling earthquake going down the highway, has a higher toll on the MH". WHAT!

Wayne, I have had some gas coaches that rode hard but not nearly that hard if your 2008 Winnebago Destination is riding that hard you need new airbags. I have watched people tow trailers by me that the whole trailer bounced over the expansion strips.

Now hearer is something I really really need help with how is it better for a long term stay to have a trailer and a big truck to drive than having a diesel pusher with much more storage and a car that gets 30 mpg and easy to drive and park. Please explain how the trailer and truck combo is better.

Bill

Thank you wise one! Bill you brought up some great points I had forgotten about. All of my friends that have trailers must drive those large clunky vehicles around the remaining parts of the year while the trailer is parked at home. So the other 340 days (give or take) of the year they get to drive a 9.0 mpg vehicle everywhere (x the national average of 12,000 miles per year...ouch) and struggle to find a place to park it. I also struggle with the math, not my strong point, so please excuse me, $70,000 for a truck $40,000 for the trailer $110,000 I didn't pay that for either coach or the combination of both including my Toad, hitches, braking systems upgrades.

Since the topic is Full timing, the above doesn't apply to its entirety....but does...

The other side of it is the storage, I had forgotten about that, my friends have to store all of their outdoor furniture in their beds and tuck the sheets tight so they don't shoot through a wall or window (paper thin) because there is little to NO storage under. A motorhome is crash tested since people ride in it, a trailer is not therefore they can be built like such (paper thin).

Now all of us "experienced" folks can agree you probably wouldn't want to sleep where your camping chairs were sitting, or would you? Mine tend to have dust, stones caught up inside the leg tubes, mud on the feet etc.... Yea I clean them off before sliding them into the basement but there is still dirt. No training class or college I went to taught me that. My friends grill, charcoal grill that is went bouncing around the interior the lid flew off and scattered charcoal dust through out the kitchen, family room area. It took both of us a while to clean it up, that was the simple part, over a few beers, I had him laughing about it in a few minutes (I am usually good at that), his DW was twisted up about it and was going to make him sleep in his truck, set the tone for a few days, you could cut the tension it was so thick.... good thing his truck was so big. I told him to sleep on the fifth wheel, after all most people post they sleep in their fifth wheels, still not sure how they don't get greasy.

Off of the subject above but none the less important, if you like to follow laws and enjoy life that is;

If you think a company vehicle is a great idea (sure...why not my Joes plumbing truck it can pull a trailer ill just use that) and you decide to use your company truck to pull your camper, you might want to think about that first especially if its labeled with your business or registered to the business. Once the trailer connects to it and you cross the 10,001 lb combined GVWR threshold its now a Commercial Motor Vehicle, which means you must follow all laws related to a CMV, here's a few; alcoholic beverages are illegal to transport, cell phones are illegal if hand held, you will need a medical card, DOT number on the door driver qualification file at your office, or home if that where you work from and it just goes on and on. Up here they are starting to crack down on that. We saw it last year in VA, DOT waving them over at a roadside inspection near a popular CG on the Chesapeake Bay. Easy to spot, ladder racks decals tool boxes etc. There were a few unhappy campers that week.

Sorry, I went off topic, but its good to point out things to the folks that are new and looking. I did consider it when I had the business and a diesel powered service truck. I camp to relax and take in the scenery, enjoy time with friends, new and old friends that is, I stared at that dash of the service truck often while working nights and weekends, when I go away I want to leave all of that behind, not be reminded of it. Not sure how it is for the rest of you but when I sit in the seat of our coach I can feel the stress melt away.

[manholt]

Rambling Joe.

My stress melted away 31 years ago....it's called Retired!

Bill. You hit the nail on the head ! Especially the "Inspector" part...

Carl

[jleamont]

See what happens before the first cup of coffee.

[RodgerS]

Happy to respond to the following:

"great deal on the used market"

I agree that with more effort, than buying from a dealer, you can find a great deal in the used market.

Some people restrict themselves to buying locally and that is understandable and I believe is more comfortable for some.

However, if you look nationally you have more options, in particular if you are focused on a specific mfg like Newmar

and if you focus on a model like a Dutch Star or Mountain Aire. Try rvt.com or rvtrader.com, for example.

Before you travel to see the coach, you can spend some time asking the owner questions, request scans of their documentation,

check with the mfg about the coach history, check with their local service provider, etc. Unfortunately, a lot of people

seem to find that the provided pictures and actual condition is often inconsistent.

You can hire an inspector to check out the coach before you travel to look at it.

"Even those who have "plenty of cash" should look at financing rather than tying up their cash in a depreciating asset."

Right, however the 10 year and older coaches seem to be tougher to finance.

At that point it is mostly a cash buyer situation.

If you buy a 10 year or older coach, and upgrade it with a budget of say $20,000, the depreciation is significantly smaller.

Financing a new or gently used coach is probably a good idea and certainly the salesman earns a financing fee so it

is better for your salesman as well.

However, there are some people who simply like not having to make payments.

Paying with cash tends to influence MY personal buying decision towards older used with significant upgrades.

"It is amazing to me all the 5th wheel aficionados whining about the "lost space" in the front of a class "A" Yet not concerned that they have nearly 75% less basement storage. By the way I could store things on the front shelf when not moving."

Yes, there seems to be a lot of buyers remorse, even by mh owners for all kinds of reasons. I guess that is the nature of this industry.

Seems like a lot of people bought without knowing what they were getting into...call it buyers remorse, not whining.

"how is it better for a long term stay to have a trailer and a big truck to drive than having a diesel pusher with much more storage and a car that gets 30 mpg and easy to drive and park."

It seems to me it is a matter of usage, which is personal.

I'm not sure I want to own a mh if I plan to go to one spot and stay a couple of months, or stay for some period of extended time.

I'm not sure I want to own a 5th if I move often like every few days or weekly. A mh seems like a better idea.

I'm not sure I want to own a Class B if I want to stay more than one or two days at any one location. Again, a larger mh seems better.

I'm not sure I want to own a Class A gas if I plan to travel across the U.S.

I'm not sure I want to own a MH if it doesn't get traveled regularly, but sits in one place most of the time.

I'm not sure, as I get older, that I don't want to try to foresee how that might affect my traveling and try to buy with some eye to that.

I'm not sure anyone cares what anyone else does as long as it doesn't restrict our traveling and fun.

Since my wife and I plan to travel internationally from time to time, not just in the U.S., I don't want to get too much cash $$ tied up in an Rv.

Edit note: my wife and I have also talked about renting a villa overseas and staying in it for an extended amount of time like two or three months. That is also another option to staying in hotels and RVing, and we can visit a lot of countries that way.

[five]

One brief comment...you guys are on a roll...re interior space. For years 5th wheels were known for having more living space. Now that many MHs have full wall slides (FWS) that is no longer true. We've had both.